 A couple of weeks ago, Texan chef Tim Love paid a visit to the 5@5 hot seat to explain why eating meat is rad and being vegetarian, well, isn't. A firestorm of 1,500 comments later, we knew we had struck a chord and needed to make room for both sides of the story. Jane Velez-Mitchell is the host of "ISSUES with Jane Velez-Mitchell," airing weeknights at 7 p.m. ET on HLN. As an outspoken vegan and animal rights advocate, she's here for a good old-fashioned omnivore-herbivore throw down - point-counterpoint style. The bell's about to ring for round two. Let's get ready to rumble. Five Reasons to Be a Vegetarian: Jane Velez-Mitchell Jane Velez-Mitchell says: "I would much rather devour a piece of well-seasoned squash than a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass. It’s guilt-free eating, which is ultimately more pleasurable. America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis, one of the nation’s leading causes of preventable illness and death. We have been brainwashed into craving a diet that is killing us. What we believe tastes good is generally what we have been socially conditioned to enjoy. There are societies that regard worms as a delicacy because that’s how they’ve been raised. Children often naturally shun the taste of meat but are forced by their misguided, although well-meaning, parents into eating it anyway. Eventually, they develop a taste for it and it becomes their 'normal.' The fact is: America’s obsession with meat and dairy has pretty much destroyed our sense of taste. The average burger and milkshake meal is so overloaded with fat, salt and sugar that it has numbed our taste buds to virtually anything else. When you give up these addictive substances, then your taste buds have a chance to return to their natural state and you will begin to enjoy the subtle flavors of fruits and vegetables, which are lower in calories and have zero cholesterol." 2. Tim Love says: "Because when you walk into a steakhouse, you never hear anyone say 'wow, doesn’t that creamed spinach smell great?' Unless, of course, the spinach is made with bacon." Jane Velez-Mitchell says: "I actually get quite sad when I smell bacon. Factory farming has made life an unimaginable hell for the billions of pigs raised and killed for food. Sows are kept in gestation crates the size of their bodies and never able to turn around or even scratch themselves. These pigs, which have an I.Q. comparable to dogs, routinely become psychotic. Stacked by the thousands in dark warehouses, these sentient beings live out their miserable lives never seeing the sky or taking in a single breath of fresh air. Americans are decent people and the only consumers who still enjoy bacon are those from whom the pork industry has managed to hide the truth. I defy anybody to look at those pig gestation crates and walk away with a hankering for a slice of bacon." 3. Tim Love says: "Imagine a restaurant full of preachy vegetarians. Enough said. I’m kidding, of course. Some of my best friends are vegetarians, but even they have a tendency to be a little on the holier-than-thou side. If I want to eat meat, let me eat it in peace. Nobody is forcing you to be a vegetarian, so why are you trying to force us?" Jane Velez-Mitchell says: "I challenge the idea that anyone can eat meat 'in peace.' It’s a contradiction in terms. How can you talk about peace if your plate is swimming in blood? America raises and kills about 10 billion animals for food every year. The overwhelming majority of those animals – cows, pigs, chickens, turkeys, lambs – are raised in hideous, overcrowded factory conditions. Ever wonder why we’re experiencing all those salmonella and swine flu outbreaks? A peak inside these factory farms would give you food for thought. We’re so darn smart but we can’t figure out that chickens packed in cages so tiny they have to be de-beaked to prevent them from pecking each other to death might be more prone to illness than chickens that have room to stretch their wings? Why do you think the vast majority of antibiotics sold in this country are used on farm animals? Because the way they’re treated makes them prone to illness! If you were stuck for your entire life in the middle seat of a crowded airplane, do you think you might be liable catch a fellow passenger’s cold? As for us vegetarians minding our own business, well, what people eat is everyone’s business. That’s because meat production is the single biggest cause of global warming - even beyond transportation. Rainforests are being leveled to create grazing land. Methane gas from the animals is rising up into the sky. Don’t take my word for it. The United Nations did a lengthy study and issued a report that’s easily accessed on the Internet. Also, factory farm run-off – yes I’m talking about all that animal waste - is creating a run-off pollution crisis that is threatening our rivers and oceans. Finally, there’s world hunger: the greatest health risk on the planet. There are almost a billion hungry people in this world. About one in seven humans do not get enough food. A lactating cow will consume every year almost six tons of forage dry matter, over 100 bushels of corn, 1,400 pounds of protein supplement, and 225 pounds of mineral/salt. You do the math. We could eliminate world hunger if, instead of concentrating all that food into meat, we fed it directly to starving people." 4. Tim Love says: "Eating vegetarian may seem like the healthier option (and, probably, often is), but when it comes down to it, meat, in moderation, provides much needed protein, iron and amino acids. As long as you don’t go overboard and eat one of those 15-pound burgers you see on TV, you should be fine." Jane Velez-Mitchell says: "If huge amounts of protein were the key to perfect health, America would be the healthiest nation on earth because we eat a lot more meat than people in most other countries. But, we’re not the healthiest. Two thirds of us are overweight or obese and the crisis is accelerating. The drumbeat of protein is a selling tool - pure and simple - and we’ve all bought into it. Americans are getting more protein than they need. There are plenty of plant-based protein sources. Ditto for iron and other essential vitamins. I’ve been vegan for a decade and a half and I’ve never been accused of not having enough energy. In fact, when I went vegan, my energy level shot off the scales. A growing number of professional athletes are going vegan and seeing their performance improve. Just in terms of common sense, look at a horse. It eats grass and hay and is extremely muscular and fast. We like to say, "eat around the animal." 5. Tim Love says: "Because you’d get a lot of funny looks if you tried roasting a pumpkin at a tailgate instead of a pig." Jane Velez-Mitchell says: "Actually, for all those who feel like they’re sleepwalking through the same old holiday and weekend habits, going vegan is like hitting the refresh button. Suddenly, all those tired traditions come alive with the injection of something new and compassionate. Instead of killing a turkey on Thanksgiving, why not go to a farm animal sanctuary and feed some turkeys? Or whip up a meal using Tofurky? That’s what I call, 'Thanksliving.' There’s no need to celebrate all special occasions with a dead animal front and center. Why not celebrate life? Take it from me. It’s fun to evolve." What's your take on the great vegetarian debate? The comment section awaits. Is there someone you'd like to see in the hot seat? Let us know in the comments below and if we agree, we'll do our best to chase 'em down. |
Wonder if Tim Love ever watched a cow or pig being lined up for slaughter in a slaughterhouse covered in its own piss and shit. Wonder if Tim Love ever watched a cow or pig being slaughtered – 2,000 per hour – alive, kicking and screaming while its skin is removed and it legs were sawed off. Wonder if Tim Love would ever have the courage to slaughter his own cow or pig for the meat he so desperately defends. Wonder if Tim Love has ANY idea how many growth hormones, antibiotics and ground up downer cows (the sick, weak and diseased cows) have been fed to the bull whose steak he champions. I wonder if Tim Love ever watched the film Earthlings or read the book "The China Study" or "The Food Revolution".
And yes, Americans are fat specifically because of all the meat (including its fat, cholesterol, growth hormones and antibiotics) they overconsume. It's simply ASTOUNDING to me how ignorant people are about their nutritional needs, the food they eat, what's in it, where it comes from, and how it's making them sick, fat and stupid.
I especially liked the part where she gave numerous references for the "fact" that Americans are fat because of all of the meat we eat. Oh wait...
Paul McCartney said it very well: "If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian." I have been vegan for over 20 years. What's the alternative? Rotting corpses - meat is murder and it is disgusting. It is smelly and gross - how can any human eat it? Dairy is mucus-producing - the only milk designed for a species is the milk of that species, so if you want to drink milk, then drink human milk. Eggs are embryos - how appetizing is an embryo? Animal products are not only unappetizing, but they are horribly cruel. It's not even just how animals are raised and kept, it's about the killing, the horrendously cruel killing, and the killing itself. If you want to eat flesh, then eat human flesh - how's that for appetizing? The prospect of eating a cow, pig, chicken, or any other animal makes about as much sense as serving your human relatives for dinner. You wouldn't do that, so don't demand that our non-human relatives be "food" - they are not food for humans. If you want to really see what is done to animals in the name of food, watch the powerful film "Earthlings" and ask others to watch it too - it's what people need to open their eyes to what is done to the animals: http://www.unleashed.org.au/features/earthlings/.
Like it, or not we are one of the sickest nations in the world. This is mainly contributed to the amount of soy and corn laden food, dairy and meat that is consumed in mass quantity. This isn't just an argument about animal cruelty, it's about consuming poorly treated animals and food that turns into poorly treated health in our bodies.
The first step in taking care of us, is taking care of the food that we consume, including vegetables and fruits. I encourage everyone to shop organically, or locally and buy REAL food, not the fake crap they sale at major supermarkets (including meat, dairy, bread, fruit and veggies). I also challenge people to have at least one vegetarian dinner a week.
Next you'll be telling me that I can't drink the water because the fish fuck in it.
You sir may bite my chicken Butt! If all the Hens listen to this nonsense I will be put out to pasture with the cows!
To the people promoting "eating less red meat", especially the vegetarians and vegans who say that – eating less red meat is all well and good for the environment and health. The problem is, simply telling people to eat less red meat may cause those people to eat more birds like chickens and turkeys. Birds already suffer the worst abused of any factory farmed animal on the planet. The documentary Fowl Play illustrates the urgency of advocating for the birds. 200 chickens are killed for every one cow, and they are raised in extremely inhumane conditions. I would actually recommend people to give up chicken and eggs first on their journey towards a more compassionate lifestyle.
United Nations latest study gives final statement:: World population need to switch to a vegan diet to save mankind from fuel poverty, hunger and climate change
Kudos to Jane Velez; at last someone talks for the benefit of the health population, the dramatic reality of the slaughterhouses. Is missing the terrible consecuences for the environment caused by livestock all over the world; animal industry is emptying seas, vanishing forests and eating and drinking all our water and food supplies. Evolving definitely is good!
What frustrates me the most, is that it doesn’t have to be one way or another! We can still have a meat-eating majority AND treat our farm animals better! I would say that over 90% of the points that she makes on why to be vegetarian are things that we, the American population, can fix by just having some will power. I’m just as guilty – I love my bacon in the morning, but it’s not a ‘one way or another’ issue. We can have both if we were just smart about it! everything in moderation, people.
The human-caused suffering of animals raised for food is intense and widespread. There are enough great-tasting animal-free dishes to last a lifetime. One place to start is http://www.vegweb.com, with thousands of recipes, mostly rated and reviewed.
I love all animals. With ketchup.
There is nothing natural about eating meat from a mega farm. As for health, I think that it is amazing that we haven't had more problems.
Maltreatment of animals is unethical.
That said, it is perfectly healthy and right to hunt. Hunting is a heritage that too many people have never experienced.
Alas, not everyone can hunt. This is why people should be buying from small local farms. You should, if you are going to eat meat, have an understanding of how the animals are cared for, how they are slaughtered and butchered.
If hunting and going direct to a farm are not possible at least support local family owned butchers. They are much rarer these days thanks to big-box-stores.
Peace!
Here's my problem with this discussion; meatitarian vs. vegetarian is not a black vs. white discussion to me. Every single night that I make dinner I like to have a small portion of chicken, steak, fish, lamb, turkey or pork. I keep dozens of packages of individually frozen and wrapped meats so I can have a choice every night of what I want. I usually like to dress it up with sauteed onions, japalenos, or mushrooms. Along with the meat, I always have a fresh vegetable such as squash, zucchini, kale, spinach, Swiss chard, or green beans. To round it out, I like to have some kind of grain like brown rice, cous cous, or wheat pasta. I love meat. I also love vegetables. I wouldn't do without one any sooner than I would without the other and I'm healthy, full of energy, and in great physical condition for my chosen activites. When people start making the argument that I'm being cruel to animals by eating meat, I say you didn't grow up on a Virginia farm and have to butcher those animals yourself when winter came along and the canned goods were running low. Do I have any guilt about killing a cow, pig, turkey, or chicken to eat them? Hell no. Do I have guilt about the plants that I am also killing to eat? Absolutely not. They were born/grown, raised, lived, and died to feed me. I've seen the argument made where people say, "How would you feel to be farmed and eaten?" Well, that would suck, wouldn't it? But it's not going to happen. I'm a sentient, self-aware creature that, with the exception of being murdered for cannibalism by my own species, will never be faced with this situation and the hypothetical argument is simply silly. And that argument that vegetarian practices is better for the environment is plain stupid. Pesticides, tractor emissions, and disruption of natural erosion processes are every bit as harmful, in the long run. In the end, it's tasty and I am healthy and happy and fully accept my role as an omnivore. You think a bear feels guilt when it eats a deer, or a cat when it eats a mouse? No more than when said bear eats some berries and certainly no more than I when I do the same.
" If I want to eat meat, let me eat it in peace. Nobody is forcing you to be a vegetarian, so why are you trying to force us?"
If I want to beat my dog, let me beat my dog in peace. Nobody is forcing you not to beat your dog so why are you trying to force us to stop?
And we are suppose to listen to what a Lesbian thinks is right to do.As if being a lesbian is normal.No it's a choice just like eating or not eating meat is your choice.
Viva la evolution! It's time for humanity to take some responsibility for itself and start eating in a way that can heal the planet, ourselves AND put an end to animal exploitation.
Its funny how all the douche bags in this post eat meat.
Humans have been omnivores since there have been on the planet.
I fail to see how doing something as drastic as to become a vegan or vegetarian is going to save the planet. Yes, I realize that this change MAY be better for me as a person, but then again, being an omnivore hasn't really been all that bad for me, either. Everything in moderation seems to be a better guide than the 'all or nothing' route most vegan/vegetarians go.
We have evolved to be omnivores. This is debatable, too. Humans closest relatives (chimps and apes) are vegetarian. Outside the occasional ants, that is. I don't think my teeth and nails are capable of tearing flesh and crunching bone.
I think it's best to keep religion out of the debate on both sides. We don't have anything solid to stand on when it comes to the Bible, the Torah, or the Quran. It's more like standing on quicksand than anything else. If anything, they're just stories. It's okay to philosophize about things, but when we have problems it's important to deal with those problem in rational and realistic ways.
What it comes down to, is doing what's right for the rest of the world. Each individual does NOT stand alone. We all share the world with others. There are no personal choices. Everything we do affects another. Sometimes sacrifice is needed to ensure a future for all.
We have to remember that humans are at the bottom of the dependence scale which means we depend on the existence of all non-human beings to exist ourselves. We need nature. Nature would do better without us. Arrogance and ignorance will be the demise of us all. Being humble may just save the planet.
We already know that a Vegan lifestyle is healthier for those who follow it, better for the environment, and better for our fellow earthlings. And it's really not that difficult to be kind and humane to all livings beings, including ourselves. Ultimate peace is in our reach.
The question is, do we really want peace. If we do, our actions prove otherwise.
I guess what frustrates me the most is that we could do better, but we don't. I'm honestly ashamed to be a human and try to do my best to go above the fray. However, we are after all the dumbest and most dangerous animal on the planet.
This can change though. We just need to be honest with ourselves and admit we are enemies of peace–that violence is an obsession (whether it's hunting, fishing, participating in war, etc.). Only then can we set out to be better and evolve into humane beings. It's not enough to be just human.
Without accepting our issues, well, denial is a dead man's game. We can't go on the way we've been living without expecting repercussions.
Let's all learn to leave nature as it's meant to be and live in harmony with it (without exploiting or using it for our own purposes) instead of trying to take it over and wiping it out. It's the difference between having a better future or non at all.
Peace.
ease
"An athiest is one who doesn't need a higher power to tell him or her to be kind and humane to all. He or she just is."
On the other hand, nobody's perfect. Certainly not me. If I've offended anyone. I apologize.
At the same time, we're passed the point of compromise. We need to get together and ensure a better future before it's too late.
I recommend a documentary called "The Age of Stupid".
Peace.
ease
I was an ethical vegetarian cook and activist for 20 yrs & was chronically ill until I started red-meat-centered diet 15 years ago & instantly became well. To vegetarians I say "good for you", but not for everyone. Some people can be healthy without meat, I know several who've been for 30+ years. Others get sickly, bad complexion, hair loss, and worse. These people know their nutrition, eat balanced meals, veg protein etc.. Vegetarian militants ("meat is murder") believe a lot of myths.
Hey this article lied. There's only 2 points.
1.)Eating animals makes me have an emotional reaction (guilt) and that's bad!
2.)Going Vegan/vegetarian can change things up on occasion. (So then wouldn't eating meat change things up for Vegheads?)
Van Dorsen, how can you possibly believe that Jane is actually speaking wisdom. The topic between eating meat or not aside, Jane's points that she makes are completely ridiculous.....because apparently to her we should kill all livestock and feed starving people the grass or corn (which cant be digested by humans) that they eat. Oh yah, and global warming (im a geological engineer and the verdict is still out on global warming vs. natural earth warming patterns through time) being caused by cow manure.....well carbon dioxide (which i am in the research field that deals with storing CO2 in rock units and for enhanced oil recovery operations and is a major greenhouse gas) is given off by all humans when they exhale so maybe we should get rid of all of us because apparently we are a large problem as well. And if you still think that im full of it, try running the numbers of much carbon dioxide is put into the air daily/yearly/etc. by humans exhaling, it would seem pretty astronomical as well. I did some research estimates calculate between 1,362,000,000 – 2,168,000,000 tonnes/year (depending on the source of average CO2 exhaled by each person) of CO2 is exhaled by the 6.6 billion humans on this planet........also i dont feel bad about eating meat in fact i go hunting all the time and love doing it, i honor the kill and respect the spirit of the wild......something vegetarians will never truly understand.
Thank you, Jane Velez-Mitchell! You speak words of wisdom and compassion. And you make good health sense! I think people get so angry at vegetarians because they feel guilty for their own insensitivity. We share this planet with other creatures and as a species we seem to be living in a pool of blood. This has to take its toll on our psyche. Anyway, thanks for your words and for your courage.
LOL
No I dont get angry at vegetarians. insensitive, thats funny. I feel deeply for an animal I kill and eat. Sure it does take a toll on a psyche.
You are a decent cnn poster. Now I am a bit annoyed you get paid to write this crap and try to sway people to your unnatural and pathetic view. But oh well.
lets see if I get banned or censored.
Great article. Well timed. Much needed information.
What are the best books to start making vegetables tastier?
What is a practical program to become vegan?
I know this has been said throughout the posts (I didn't read them all). However Tim and Jane are both bad examples of extremes. I personally do not eat meat, and have not for almost 8 years, at first my family was sort of upset with me and sincerely concerned for my well-being (Eating Skittles and cheese is not a healthy diet). My entire family eats meat, and while I encourage them to try soy based products, many times they prefer the taste and texture of meat. It is their choice. I don't preach to anyone, granted I get the typical "You can't have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!" responses when I'm around people who think that PETA actually stands for People Eating Tasty Animals. I will rebel and give my views, but it takes two to tango, and two to debate, so why waste my energy trying to convince them that it's ok, I'm not going to die if I don't have meat. And on that topic, PETA is the worst "animals rights machine" I've ever heard of. They use celebrity appeal and money to start fad's for teenagers to follow and become "the sexiest vegetarian of the year". Who cares about sexy these days? I mean in the real world sexy doesn't "beef" up your paycheck. PETA is a monopoly of greedy people trying to claim that global warming exists because of meat eaters. Has anyone ever heard of the ICE AGE? The Earth naturally goes through cycles. Granted, humans in this day and age may be "egging" on the earth a little bit...but not that much. What about the volcano in Iceland that exploded back in May? I would bet any of you, that single eruption put more pollution in the air in a week than humanity's entire existence for a years worth of automobiles, factory farming, "cows farting", traffic jams in big cities, industrial revolution in China and India, and so on.
Getting back to the point...Let's look at it this way. Buddhist's by nature are vegetarians because of their beliefs, except that the Dalai Lama is not a vegetarian. Can you believe it, the most revered Buddhist monk is NOT a vegetarian, and you know why? Because in the mountains of Tibet it's sort of hard to grow vegetables all year long. Being a vegetarian in America is a choice, trust me. Being a vegetarian in a place where you cannot grow vegetables (ie, Iniuit's in Alaska, or Tibetan mountains) is impossible. Without whale blubber those people would freeze to death! And if everything has a "right" to live, why don't the extremists ship soy products, non-wheat gluten products, fresh grains and seeds for them to plant in their permafrost environment! See how quickly the grains and seeds grow!
I am a vegetarian because that's the lifestyle I chose. My brother eats meat, rarely, but still eats it, because that's the lifestyle he chooses. Both meat eaters and vegetarians alike need to stop this bickering. Karma (some of you may call this "fate") has a way of coming sneaking up on you and when it does, it can be nasty or it can be good. But either way, you reap what you sow. The actions we all take now will directly affect our futures. So let's all stop bickering and move on with our lives as a society. As Roger Water's famous line goes "Together we stand. Divided we fall".
Well put. Thanks for a breath of sanity.
I think Anthony Bourdain put it perfectly; "it's not that vegetarian food is bad. It's just that it would be better with meat."
Reason #6
Get in your pants
Great and true comments Jane. Vegan is the only way to go – shame is most human animals have a larger stomach than brain and just can't figure the health damage from ingesting dairy, meat , factory farmed, antiobiotic laden chickens etc is costing themselves – and the abused animals – quality of life.
Wonderfully written. And kudos to CNN for allowing Jane's rebuttal to be printed in its entirety.
My parents raised me as a vegetarian (not vegan), so I do like the taste of meat, but find plenty of tasty non meat dishes. I am 76 years old and a recent heart cath sowed that my heart vessels arr CLEAR -no plaque at all. I have very good health and energy. I have plenty of friends and family who eat meat and when we go out I can always find good food even at a steak house without commenting on their diet.
Did you know being vegetarian is part of the Politically Correct Manifesto? Yes, it's right after the part where humans accept blame for anything bad that's ever happened since time began, and right befor the part where we give the right to vote to slugs.
Wow, glad you contributed to the discussion, PC. You really have a wonderfully overblown point. Did you know Hitler was a vegetarian? That means, all vegetarians Nazis. Oh, and yeah, you're TOTALLY right on about that exceptionally vague claim that humans accept blame for everything "bad" that's happened since the beginning of time. The Politically Correct Manifesto is the only organization that's correctly pinned genocide, war, rape, and the like on cows and ferrets. Keep on preaching, brother!
I'd take her a lot more seriously if she didn't start every point with "MEAT IS DISGUSTING EWW ROTTING CARCASS!"
that sentiment is lost on her target audience, the meat eaters who look at this to learn about her cause.
got to draw a line someplace along the spectrum of Vegetarian, White meat, red meat, snails, rodents, worms, monkey, humans....(ie cannibalism). why not draw it at the lowest level, because the other side getting complicated for various reasons.
I grew up mostly vegetarian, then started eating meat in college, but now trying to put the brakes on again. Once in a while get cravings for hamburgers from Mcdonalds.
id go vegan for a piece of that
I'm a vegetarian. I don't like to preach. I don't care what other people eat. Likewise, I'd like it if people kept their opinions off my plate.
When I go to a BBQ and pass on the burgers, people lash out at me. THEY get preachy – some even seriously angry! I don't launch into a tirade about health, the environment, and basic kindness to animals, but still, meat-eaters feel free to lecture me about why MY personal decisions about what to eat are wrong. Yet, the minute someone says "vegetarian," people flip out. I don't get it. If I'm at a public event, like a wedding or conference, and politely (and quietly) ask if there's a vegetarian option, meat-eaters interject! What I eat seems to be up for discussion EVERYWHERE I go. In my experience, there are far more preachy meat-eaters than vegetarians.
Similarly, the original article and the response revolve around one idea: food. So why do topics about abortion and capital punishment turn up? Why can't we have a legitimate discussion about the pro's and con's of both sides without taking it to such extremes? I know people have strong opinions, but keep it on topic! What happened to respecting the opinions of others?
fuck animals. they would eat us if they were more intelligent than us
Many have said that being a vegan/vegetarian is a matter of evolution. If so, then natural selection will take care of the problem and there is no need to argue the point. Wait a few generations and only the meat eaters or the vegetarians will be around in any significant numbers. If they are both still around then the argument from an evolutionary standpoint is ridiculous as it makes no difference.
"I defy anybody to look at those pig gestation crates and walk away with a hankering for a slice of bacon."
I guarantee I'll be wondering when that fat little piggy is going to end up on my plate. Fresh bacon? Hell yeah....
Sometimes, I just want a big juicy burger! Nothing else will do!
"If I want to eat meat, let me eat it in peace. Nobody is forcing you to be a vegetarian, so why are you trying to force us?" OK, I have to agree. I don't eat much meat (maybe twice a month) and when I do, it's from local, organic farms in my state. Free range chickens, grass fed beef. I wonder what her objections to that would be?
Anyone notice how many words the Vegan/Vegie heads need to say they agree with Jane???? HOw about just saying "Yeah.. go girl".
Wow, she sure has the preachy part down pat. "Plate swimming with blood", your beef might be OK kike that, but your chicken no. The thing is that humans require certain proteins, amino acids, and vitamins for good health. The best source of many of those is meat. We also require fruits and vegetables; we're omnivores. If you want to think that "meat is murder" and other cutesy sophomoric notions that's great, but don't ever come into my kitchen and tell me what to eat!
Yeah, because sooooo many people are breaking down your kitchen door and telling you what you can and cannot eat.
Typically preachy vegetarian that spews the same crap over and over and over again. I love vegetables, but to eat them exclusively – no way on this earth.
Okay, look – not all vegetarians are as preachy as a lot of people make them out to be. Not all vegetarians are how they're stereotyped. Look, if you want to eat meat, knock your socks off. Why are you so busy worrying about how vegetarians are going to see you and just live your life? Get over it. Some people are vegetarians. Some people are idiots about it, and others don't preach it. So put your big kid pants on and deal with it.
Jane – Really appreciate your taking up for those with no voice.
Thanks so much,
Howie & Lynn
Jane's got it right: meat is MURDER! If you disagree, then let's hear your viewpoint: http://tinyurl.com/27tucmr
Some animals deserve to die. They're not all innocent you know.
I have decided to try the vegetarian way of life. It is not because animals are dying. It sounds cruel to say so but if they provide healthy nourishment to people that doesn't bother me. It is what is added that I don't like. Human Growth Hormones and daily antibiotics to our cattle that is now rendering our antibiotics useless. Now they are contemplating giving drugs to salmon to make them mature in 18 months instead of three years. I am done!
Let us know how the increased pesticides and genetically engineered plants work for you. And if you think vegan is a utopia. Research what farm chemicals are doing to the Guilf. Worse than BP ever did and organic farming is incapable of replacing our current food crop system.
I want those growth hormones so that I can become super human!
I personally gave up eating meat, except for one or two days out of the week. It has made a considerable amount of change in my health and I feel great. I'm not hating on meat eaters at all, the days I do eat meat I make it count and I enjoy it that much more. We are a meat saturated society and take it too far, which is easy to fall into and does lead to obesity and undesired consequences. I swear they'd insert meat into toothpaste if they could. Anyway just a thought, becareful with what you eat. Lots of good food out there!!
Saw her on Dr. Phil once. She's been known to eat the occasional Fish Taco... just sayin...
This list should be one reason long. That reason being, "because you want to be." End of discussion.
Is that a leather watch band??? Bet her Mercedes has leather seats too..
To the person who said “It’s called the food chain, learn about it.” The food chain in nature is completely different than the food chain we have created. In nature, there are certain animals that NEED meat to survive, (as opposed to just liking the taste of it), and they hunt for their meat. Their prey has had a life in the wild to enjoy up until that point. We, on the other hand, do NOT need meat to survive, and are far from the food chain as nature intended. Read “Farm Sanctuary” by Gene Baur – slaughterhouses and stockyards aren’t anywhere close to the wild. Also, the number three point made by TimLove really bothers me: . Tim Love says: "Imagine a restaurant full of preachy vegetarians. Enough said. I’m kidding, of course. Some of my best friends are vegetarians, but even they have a tendency to be a little on the holier-than-thou side. If I want to eat meat, let me eat it in peace. Nobody is forcing you to be a vegetarian, so why are you trying to force us?"
Actually, as a vegan, I feel I have to keep my opinions to myself, to avoid pissing off my omnivorous friends (that anger, I believe, is a result of guilt because they know the truth – but want to keep enjoying meat. I know that was my response for awhile as a meat eater, and that was why). While, on the other hand, omnivores take every chance they can to tell me I’m crazy, my food is gross, tell me I’m going to be unhealthy, make snarky comments about how ridiculous it is and how tasty meat is, and/ or defend the omnivore lifestyle. All this only when I can’t avoid telling them I’m a vegan , such as when I’m offered animal products. I’m not rubbing my beliefs in anyone’s face, and yet I’m expected to put up with omnivores rubbing their beliefs in mine? If I even try to respond with reasons, they get defensive. Well, if you attack me, I’m allowed to defend my point of view. Sorry. BULLS***T to the people who say we preach to them – if anything, it’s the other way around.
THANK you Katie! In my experience, meat-eaters have been far more preachy than the vegetarians I know. Gross.
Being carnivorous is part of nature. It is necessary to remain on top of the food chain to maintain the ecological balance.
The smarter we become, the less red meat we will eat; the less red meat we eat, the smarter we will become.
Start by conducting some research, e.g., read "The China Study" ; go to pubmedcentral.gov and type in "red meat"; read the research; then see how much red meat you continue to eat. In general, excluding fish, plant foods are by far he healthiest foods for the mind. Note that research into neurodegenerative conditions is increasingly correlating red meat consumption with such conditions. For example, what is the relationship between Alzheimer's disease and Mad Cow disease? They are now thought to be prion diseases, where prions represent a new class of infectious agents. Now let's ask ourselves - why do incidences of Alzhemier's disease, Parkinson's disease, general senile dementia, and so on, increase in proportion to red meat consumption? You guessed it. Note, for example, it has been determined that if you are injected with Alzheimer's proteins from the brain of an affected individual, you will contract the disease. Underlying causal factors include infectious agents. Now what happens when you eat cow meat that came from a senile cow? Well, you eat it; I'll watch; wait 30 years; then get back to me.
This woman sounds a bit preachy to me. I've been a vegetarian for 12 years, and the thing I hate is when people who eat meat treat me like I'm stupid for being a vegetarian. When I go out with people I've just met, and I need to make a special order (ex. remove the chicken from a pasta dish), or I verify that something is vegetarian, a lot of times, people will say, "You're a vegetarian?? I NEED my meat." 1. No, you really don't, and 2. I don't bother you and criticize what you're eating, so really, shut up. Just shut up.
I just want to be a vegetarian and have people respect the fact that I don't eat meat and leave me alone. Unless I start berating you for eating meat, you have no room to talk about what's on my plate. You don't see people making fun of Jewish people for not eating a cheeseburger. To me, not eating meat is as important to me, as following religious dietary guidelines are to followers of those respective religions.
So, what really needs to happen is for people to stop being intolerant, and people need to start worrying about themselves and not others.
Jen, I do understand what you are trying to relay but the fact is some people do need meat. Your assumption states that nobody does, suggests that you may have a bit of a stuck up problem when it comes to food. Please understand that I do believe you when you say people bother you about not eating meat but please do not do the same thing back to meat eaters.
Are you serious? Beef isn't forbidden for Jews to eat only pork is. I'm Jewish, and I happen to eat beef and pork because I'm a Reform Jew not a Hasidic or Conservative one. Also, I have an O positive blood type, which means I actually need meat, so yeah there actually are people that need meat. I'm not offended by your ignorance just a little baffled that you know so little about the Jewish religion and health.
You know what? No. Humans eat meat. Period. Vegiteriansi in general, and vegans in particular are a little too pedantic about this in a "we're all VERY sure animals have feelings" way.
The simple solution to stop killing so many animals for meat would be to eat larger animals. I think we should only eat elephants and whales.
The problem with this ladies core arguments is they are based on a belief that animals are morally equivalent to human beings. That is not a given. Most individuals and, in fact, all societies in history have made a clear distinction about the moral standing of human beings and the moral standing of animals. Some religious faiths may fudge the moral equivalency around certain animals, thinking of Hindus in particular. But, the fact is that it is a strained position for an individual to hold to the sort of moral equivalence that this woman holds to. Are factory farming conditions a problem? Yes, but not on moral grounds. Are Americans disproportionately overweight compared to the rest of the world? Yes, but probably due to our enormous consumption of cheap, high calorie, high carbohydrate foods. While protein rich meats tend to also be fat rich, our body isn't nearly as well tuned for converting animal fat into body fat as it is at converting simple sugars and carbs into fat stores.
In the end this woman simply isn't as well informed as she thinks and is basing her argument on emotionalism and an appeal to a moral authority that isn't grounded or agreed upon. Eat meat, it's ok.
It basically comes down to if you believe treating animals that way is right or wrong. A lot of people just see them as food, I am one of them. I'm not going to start an organization about the way vegetables are grown...
I had a conversation with a tomato once, now I cant eat one.
I don't think Ms. Velez-Mitchell actually has kids, because if she did, she would know that infants actually naturally shun VEGETABLES, not meat! The reason is that meat has densely packed calories compared to vegetables, and more calories from fat, which infants need. Way to do your research ma'am. I wish these talking "air"heads would just report the facts from those who know them, and make things up as they go along! That's the problem with all of the media today.
1. Genetics, humans developed the brain we have today because we consumed animal protein.
2. Humans developed Canine teeth so they can tear meat appart
3. Thousands of years of evolution and there's always some skeptic. If you don't like eating meat, it's ok, but don't make it sound like parents force theor kids and brainwash them to do so. And America is FAT not because of meat... because of their eating habits.
What, I actually have to feel guilty when I eat meat? Sorry, eating a hamburger is completely "guilt-free" for me. Let us eat what WE like, everyone has things they like and don't like, so STOP trying to force your personal views on everyone else. When you vegans start spewing all this junk it really just makes you all look so crazy that no one is going to pay attention to you. For the record, I am 6'1" and weigh 163lbs.
This article is ridiculous. I don't eat a lot of meat but am definitely not a vegetarian. The author needs to go back to grade school and learn about how write a persuasive speech. Studies show that it is better to eat a well balanced diet. Period. We are not an obese nation because we eat animal products... we are an obese nation because we FRY those animal products and then eat three times the serving we should have.
I concur with Jane Velez-Mitchell. Every piece of her comments is true, genuine and convincing. I wish everyone learned from her comments.
As homo Sapiens, we didn't get the top of the food chain to eat just fruits, grains, and vegetables. I find it odd that Vegans are opposed to eating meat, yet they make food that's resemble the taste, texture, and appearance of meat products. I get amused and even laugh at people who think slaughtering animals to eat them is morally wrong, and then ask us meat eaters how we can sit there an eat a steak, pork chop, lamb chop, etc. Easily, one bite at a time. I feel just as bad eating meat as a friggin Cheetah does after it kills and eats an Gazelle.
The question I've always had for vegetarians/vegans: Is nature wrong? I know you have personal reasons for not eating meat (health, animal rights, etc.), but nature has provided humans with teeth for both cutting and tearing meat and grinding plants. That means, by nature's standards, we are meant to be omnivores. So, is nature wrong?
I'm a vegetarian. I can tell you that I absolutely don't mind people who eat meat. Personally, I don't care for it. I can eat out comfortably knowing the worst thing that has happened to my vegetables is that they sat in the cooler a day too long or that they are slightly undercooked and underseasoned. I havn't had a foodborne illness for as long as I can remember, so I definitely believe that my lifestyle is healthier than a person who consumes copius amounts of meat, if only for the fact that I can eat at a restaruant without really worrying if my food has been cooked properly. That being said, who cares if someone eats meat or not, I believe in personal freedom, that means I could care less what you choose to do with your life, the world would be a much better place if everyone were like that.
No any meat eaters that look that good at 55? I don't. Go Jane!
first off its KNOW not "No"...
secondly by the time your 55 you should be happily married and shouldn't have to give a fuck if you look good or not because your spouse will love you no matter what.
It's 'you're', not your. Just saying.
On the contrary, most vegans I met in college looked like they ready to pass out from malnourishment at any second
That is such a typical narrowminded response. Sure, because your friend has a limited vegetarian/vegan diet that's undeniable proof humans aren't designed to be vegeterian or vegan. If you're friend is on the verge of collapsing then quite frankly she/he is either lazy or misinformed on what it is she should be eating. A vegetarian diet can provide you with ALL nutrient meat eaters currently obtain (second hand) from animals. All that's needed is a well balanced selection of vegetarian food to keep you healthy. It's easy to be lazy and eat the same vegetables everyday, or pasta and bread everyday, what do you expect? A varied vegetarian diet is extremely healthy. I can speak from personal experience being a vegetarian for almost a year, I have never felt healthier or more full of energy. Done properly, there is no better diet.
She cheats. I saw here in In-and-Out Burger one night scarfing down a bacon cheeseburger.
we could argue semantics all day for both sides. SO SHUT THE FUCK UP. you vegetarians can believe what you want and you meat eaters can too... everyone needs to stop trying to force their beliefs on one another
You are entitled o your own opinions but you are not entitled to your own facts.
Go, Jane! Vegetarian, here!
There are a lot of people posting that are clueless about nutrition and espicially the advantages of being a vegetarian. Love how so many people think they understand it when they are clueless!
"America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis" DUMBEST STATEMENT EVER MADE...
Is eating all about taste?, really?. Because if it is then your just a greedy glutton. What you eat should be healthy and aid the planet as well as your body. Meat doesn't do that. Fact. Its also immoral to imprison an animal, stuff it full of drugs, force it to reproduce, flush the drugs via its manure and urine into the air and waterways poisoning the environment and third world people, and then have it packaged and processed as "meat" chocked full of preservatives and then sold as "healthy food". Meat is not sustainable, its cruel, its out dated, and bottom line is its cons far away its pros. And meat is also tasteless unless seasoned-ALL FOOD IS. veg can be flavored just like meat-try Indian food, much of it is vegetarian and most of it is far from bland.
It say something that most meat-eaters comments content with half-truths. All they want is to justify something that they know, deep inside, that it's plain wrong. You just want to keep on doing it because of the flavor in you mouths and don't give a shit about anything else. Probably all those fats in your cortex...
This woman uses some of the silliest arguments. Look at a horse with its grass and hay diet showing off its strength? I bring my lion back here too!! Look at a lion/tiger/crocodile/bear and then compare them to a giraffe/your horse. Find me a single instance that you think your horse would win over my lion? Enough said.
P.S. I am so bitter because I am tired of hearing all the god damn vegetarians/animal lovers telling me how my meat diet is so bad. Well you know what, if evolution thinks your say is the right way, then one day we (meat eaters) will disappear from earth and you will reign high and mighty. But till then, deal with our love for meat. :)
Lmfao, global warming is a hoax created by Al Gore to make business for all the green companies. Try thinking back about our depleting Ozone layer. Lol what happened to that? Nothing. You probably don't even remember that we were really concerned about our ozone layer having a hole in it when was rapidly getting bigger until it started getting smaller again. As for the global warming issue, if you check out some statistics about the melting polar ice caps, you'll see that the deposit of ice in recent years have been really heavy. Enough said?
I hate vegetables. I will eat them, but I hate vegetables !! Enough said.
However, from the tone of the conversation, the interviewer set out to prove how vegetarians are so much better in health. But my only problem is, why won't you bitch at a freaking lion for eating a gazelle !!! Animal rights?? What we are animals for killing other animals and its ok for a lion to kill? Go save that freaking gazelle and will stop eating meat !!! Yeah I associate myself with lions when you tell me its not cool to eat meat. As for the poor conditions that these animal are subjected to? Think about it as the holocaust. It happened and we couldn't do anything about it then but now we can talk about it :) maybe when the animals become as powerful as the jew they can tell us to F off !!
I agree with the sentiments of Jane. I have been a vegetarian my whole life (sorry not a vegan). What you get being a non meater is a better and healthy life. You are more kind person, less arrogant. All the comment above from meat lover was expected as they have lost their spiritual sense. Try being vegetarian for a month and you will notice a diffrence.
Thats so true Himanshu. I've been vegetarian for almost a year now and I feel like my whole world's been opened up. I feel so much happier, and more spiritual, and I have a clarity that I've never had before.
CNN, while I am a lover of my hamburger and bacon eating habits, I have always maintained an open mind about vegetarianism. However, you do vegetarians a disservice by posting bitter, pro-vegetarian rhetoric like this rooted in sensationalism. Tim Love comes off as humorous and tongue-in-check speaking about vegetarians, while Jane Velez-Mitchell comes across as though Love is trying to grill her children. Any time Love makes an intelligent point, Mitchell's response consistently boils his point to one specific word mentioned (bacon, peace, etc.), and she then rambles into a sensationalized tangent story to support vegetarianism and portray meat consumption as barbaric.
Mitchell sounds like a fool as shes says, "Children often naturally shun the taste of meat but are forced by their misguided, although well-meaning, parents into eating it anyway." Why? Because last I checked children don't fawn to brussell sprouts or asparagus, but rather develop a taste for these as well.
Derek
Thanks for your post- It's the best one here. I always felt that selfishness is the worst quality that humans
possess, and the arguments and rationalizations posted by the meat eaters here demonstrate that clearly.
And to all you loving parents who feed your kids meat and argue that it's 'natural' I'd like to ask: Would you
allow your five year old to go on a day trip to a 'meat processing factory' where pigs are slaughtered for
their dinner? Of course not. It would traumatize them for life. Think about that the next time you take them
to a movie about cute farm animals, and then feed them the same animals for dinner. Selfish and blind.
It's interesting. The arguments against vegaterianism/veganism range from the infantile to the insane, and I wonder whether the people making them have thought about the subject for more than a few seconds before typing their inane replies. I teach critical thinking students to at least familiarise themselves with the subject matter to some degree before engaging in a rebuttal of a position. The arguments in support of meat-eating cannot be called rational by any stretch of the imagination; their base is inevitably speciesist, egoist and self-indulgent, and demonstrate ignorance of science, logic, ethics and ecology. Will they go away and think about this now, and examine the issue a little more? Doubtful. People who are already convinced they're right don't entertain anything contrary to their preconceptions, One must question, therefore, their intelligence, and indeed the intelligence of the species, since highly intelligent people question their own thinking mercilessly. Given the current state of the planet, I wonder whether humanity is intelligent enough to survive the next 100 years. From the above evidence, I am not convinced, and I very much doubt whether the universe will care. I certainly wouldn't.
That is a brilliant reply.
wow. thanks JVM!! i mean all anyone really has to do is watch one video of these factory farms and how they treat these animals. its amazing that all these meat eaters, psh, dont have some kind of disease or arent dead. its hateful, and disgusting to continuously stuff a cow or a chicken or whatever else these people eat down their throats. they dont even taste good. chicken is dry and red meat tastes like straight blood, at least thats how i remember meat to taste.completely disgusting.
I'm now dumber for reading most of these comments. This is proof that meat, fish, and other animal-based foods do rot your brain. So does conservatism and following the status quo.
I'd rather be alone on the path to peace than join the crowd over the cliff of violence.
Think for yourself. Be happy, healthy, and humane. Go Vegan:)!
ease
I understand where Jane Velez-Mitchell is coming from. I went vegetarian after I learned that pigs on factory farms have their balls cut off without any painkiller, and that chickens are bread to grow so fat so fast that their legs often break under their own weight. There's more info here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4YX_iVWIe0
These two articles were just stupid ideas. It was meant to do nothing but cause intense debating, or as we in America do... calling the other side idiots.
I will bring this point up again though. An ecosystem can only support so many free animals. Where I am from, the deer population can grow very large and often can leave many deer to starve to death. I hunt deer each fall, normally I use a bow but after a shoulder injury I did have to resort to a gun last year. I also tend to use just about every part of the animal that I can. I use the bones to make simple hand tools or jigs when I work on things, and the hide I usually give to people that make clothing.
Is it wrong to eat meat in that case? Or on another note, as I am in college now it is a lot more difficult to have the money or time to go hunting and buy the more expensive organic meats. However, as I have killed and prepared my own food, I have no problems knowing how a slaughter house works. I do try to find brands that are more humane, but I do the best with the money I have. Is this somehow wrong?
I also try to reduce the amount of meat that I do eat. I have cut out red meats almost entirely, except for weeks when money is even tighter and a pound of ground beef goes a long way. I also have tried to learn of different types of meals I can make without meat. I do usually eat meat at least 1 meal a day, but I also have a large variety of veggies. I tend to eat a lot of poultry, venison, and buffalo when I have the money to get some.
There is a lot of misinformation out there about benefits of a vegiterian diets versus a balanced diet that includes meats. If you don't over consume meats then there are no real benefits of either diet. Yes, certain proteins are more easily gotten from meats, but you also get more fiber from vegetable based diets. Cholesterol is also higher in meats, but vegetables lack B12. A very well balanced mix of both can be helpful. The problem with obesity is not caused by eating meat, but rather by eating too much food. It also has a lot to do with not working out enough.
I think its insensitive of both sides in how they often react to the others. I do enjoy meeting people who are vegetarians of different cultures. Usually because they are vegetarians because of how they are raised, and not any personal convictions. I work with a guy from India who I get quite a few recipes from when I want to try something different. Because we tend to get along well, and because we don't harass each other because of our beliefs, not only have I tried foods I would not have otherwise but he has actually tried a number of meat dishes that he otherwise would not have.
I detest factory farming, but it also reduces the cost of food. The same is true with vegetables. Large farms using lots of pesticides are usually much cheaper than organic produce. When money is the deciding factor of what is eaten, you do the best with what you have. I would love to have the money to be able to know that I didn't have to resort to foods with pesticides or growth hormones.
Watch out for the ground breaking Documentary film Don't Eat Me coming summer of 2011 to get more info please check out http://www.donteatme.com Not only this film will answer all of your questions it will also provide reasonable solutions.
Please take the Veg Pledge sign up at http://www.animalfreedomday.com
Wouldn't it be grand if people would spend even half as much time researching and learning for themselves about the topics discussed in this article as they do whining and debasing each other? (a rhetorical question) In other words, I'm not asking, I'm just sayin'...
So research, make an informed decision for yourself, educate others who care to learn, and celebrate our differences.
To everyone on here who has brouhgt up the abortion and sanctity of life issue: Why should animals be viewed any different? God created animals and gave them life, who are we to take that away? A Jewish friend of mine even showed me a passage in the Torah that said that animals even have SOULS. How can you pick and choose which forms of sentient life are sacred? Answer: You can't!
Indeed. And anyone who thinks the Bible says that animals were given to us for food needs to re-read Genesis. I'm pro-life for the same reason I'm vegetarian and anti-death penalty. So much senseless and abhorrent slaughter in the world today.
I find it interesting that whenever someone suggests that we shouldn't eat meat how defensive the meat eaters become. My take is this: the meat eaters know that the animals they eat live a horrendous life full of fear and pain, but they don't want to think about. So they become defensive. Most people are humane and want the animals treated humanely, however – there is nothing humane about slaughter no matter how the animal is raised. The fact it, most of our farmed animals are sick and suffering. Meat eaters know this and become defensive because they don't want to change their lifestyle. But in the end, by consuming meat and dairy otherwise humane people participate in inhumane practices.
I think you've hit the nail on the head there Tracey. I do believe that's the reason people get defensive when you try to HELP them. They do not want to think about it. I believe every human being has that place inside them where they know its wrong to eat meat, but they choose not to tap into it. Life's easier eating meat, it tastes too good, its convenient, its too much hard work to change. I'll just keep it at the back of my mind and carry on living as I am.
People don't like change when they believe it will make their lives harder, so they bury their emotions and ignore the issue. I believe the reason they get defensive in the first place is because you're making them check into that guilt and you're making them think about what they're doing, and they just dont like it. Makes them uncomfortable.
It's really sad, we're only trying to help. My life is so much better since I turned vegetarian, I see every living thing in such a different light. It's beautiful and I will never turn back. I just want everyone to feel as happy as I do :(
Just thought I'd point out... today is National Vegetarian Awareness Day in the U.S. I celebrate it like I do every day-by not eating meat. Everyone else is getting super touchy about this, so I will too.
When you eat meat, it's a DEAD ANIMAL. No way around it. You are eating what has been cut off of an animal's carcass, sometimes it's been ground up and shaped to fit in a bun, and it's cooked until it gets brown and crusty. And factory farm foods aren't very sanitary. One hamburger you buy at a restaurant contains the meat of a LOT of cows. That greatly increases your chance of getting mad cow disease. Just imagine this- you're in a cage so small, you can't move AT ALL. It is smelly, dark, and unsanitary. You are pumped full of hormones, and what you eat smells a lot like the other things in cages around you. There are other humans all around you, and when a cow comes along and takes them out of a cage, they never come back. This is what happens EVERY DAY with the roles reversed. I have no moral objection to eating other creatures to survive, BUT lions and wolves don't keep their prey in disgusting living conditions, like we do. Feeling hungry?
And, I'm SICK of all you carnivores going off about how vegetables are murder. Stop eating if that's how you feel. It's for the good of the planet.
Wow, this topic has spawned quite a long list of comments! Maybe I can help sort this out.
Are we meant to be omnivores or vegetarians?
Obviously either, as both groups would not be alive or functioning if we were meant to be one or the other, from a health standpoint. But the same could be asked, "were we meant to be good or bad, republican or democrat, rich or poor, liking cats or dogs...etc etc etc.." We are humans capable of being many different things and many different ways... Our bodies may be "capable" of being either, but that does not mean both ways are healthy or that both ways are ok ethically.
Is a vegetarian diet healthy?
Yes, as if we haven't noticed, a vegetarian diet has been shown in innumerable studies for the past several decades to decrease your risk of many diseases, like cancers (not always, but you get the picture) and especially heart disease. ANY diet can be "done wrong," like when a vegetarian eats only macaroni and cheese and potato chips and candy, and thus develops deficiencies. However, if done with any basic nutrition knowledge, a vegetarian diet provides major health benefits.
Actually, technically speaking, meat is not needed at all in the human diet, for most people.
All nutrients can be gained through plant and/or animal products. You can eat meat, and grass fed/natural meats are better, but the main health benefits, study after study shows, is not from meat but from vegetables and fruit. We're supposed to be getting 5-9 servings of fruit and vegetables, and eating a lot of meat doesn't leave much room for that.
Restating, anyone with any basic nutrition knowledge can steer away from any deficiencies on a vegetarian diet. And by the way, which is better to have: Any few minor and improbable deficiencies you catch at your doctor's visit, which you correct by tweaking your diet and calling up a dietitian and then adding more beans and OJ, for example - Or a
massive coronary which results in quadruple bypass surgery or simply death? I'd rather have the former.
In addition, cholesterol is only found in animal flesh and products. Vegetables and fruit, nuts and grains have NO cholesterol.
Animal products like dairy and eggs contain Vitamin B12 ( no need to kill an animal) and btw, B12 is made from bacteria, not animals. Omega-3's can be gotten from plant sources as long as there isn't too much Omega-6 in the diet. Iron is not an issue if iron-rich plant foods are eaten with Vitamin C. Calcium is not an issue if calcium-rich plant foods are eaten without a lot of salt, and if weight bearing exercise is implemented.
Is killing animals wrong?
Well, let's put it this way – Animals are NOT needed for our survival, so is it wrong to kill them just for our desire to eat them and their taste?
On diet and spirituality
I notice that so many Christians ignore the verse in Genesis 1:29 that says we are to eat vegan foods. After the land was cursed we see references that allow us to eat other foods. But it does seem that the initial request from God was to be vegan. The Bible also says "in the end, the lion shall lay down with the lamb." ? Also, many other religions, such as those of Seventh Day Adventists and Buddhism.
So, CAN we eat meat?
Yes, God (or nature, however you look at it) has given us the ability to eat meat in case we need to, like if we were stranded in a desert or in Antarctica, for example.
Should we eat meat?
God gives us that choice, then stands back and watches. Just like that bank over there. We could rob it, or not rob it. For most of us, eating meat is not required for our health, unless you live in the Arctic in an igloo or in a desert. We do not need meat at all, especially in today's society with grocery stores everywhere, and actually, the removal of it would most likely be beneficial. If we required meat to survive, all the vegetarians alive today would perish. So again, knowing that we do not need to eat meat to survive, should we? Which choice do you think Jesus and God would be happier with?
Why is everyone so defensive about vegetarianism and why is it such a hot topic?
No one wants to be told they shouldn't be doing something, especially when it tastes good to them. When it comes to compassion, deep thought and morals and what is right and wrong - it is a very personal decision for each person. Evolution takes a long time for some. You have to be ready to take it to the next step. Most people probably want to figure it out on their own that they need to be a more ethical, moral person, and don't like to think someone else "got there" first. Vegetarians, keep educating, and hang in there and be sensitive and patient!
Very excellent post, thank you for taking the time to write it!
Very very very very very well written...I don't think I could have ever said it better myself...
As per previous posts that's the best answer to one of these debates I've read in a while. As a frustrated vegetarian trying to get my points across and help people this pretty much covers everything I want to say to people. Thanks :)
I like :)
I can appreciate pro-vegetarian arguments for ethical and environmental reasons, and even a few health reasons (healthy vegetarians rarely eat processed food and are often careful about where they source their food), and I agree that factory farming is horrible for all three reasons (and that includes factory farmed grains, vegetables, and fruits, btw). However, it would be nice if Jane Velez-Mitchell had mentioned, even once, that not all meat eaters source all their meat from factory farms. On all three points (ethical, environmental, and health), pastured animals score head and shoulders above factory farms- considerably higher than even organic factory farms. Can we not at least agree that if you choose to eat meat, that it should be more ethically sourced? Remember, that all of those negative statistics in relation to meat is from studies that used either processed meat or factory farmed meat.
And as for taste buds, I do believe that has much more to do with the disgusting junk that's pumped into our processed foods than it has to do with meat, dairy, salt, and even sugar. Since eliminating almost all processed foods from my diet, I enjoy vegetables and fruits much more... and my pastured meat, and pastured dairy.
WELLSAID EVOLVE IHAD SAID THE SAME WORD FEW DAYS AGO ON PETA -EVOLVE than going bacwards in human history when pre historic humans ate flesh--
I am 14 years old and i am a vegatarian. I know that most adulds might think us teenagers are to small to understand bein a vegartaian but as you can see there needs to be more people that love animals like we do. Don't get me wrong yes people that arnt vegartaians love aninimals to but they don't read at what is put in there food all they know is that it is so good that they think that they need more and more. Think about what is put in your mouth. My mama has told me so much out of the 5 family members just me and my mama are vegatarians. No i am not a vegan i hope one day i will be a vegan and be a strick vegatarian. I want to know everything about everthing for bein a vegatarian. I love all the new choses i have been make. I feel better in my heart that i am saving at least one animal. I understand that not this whole world is goin to be a vegatarian but i think it will be better. How do you know that we were put on this earth to eat meat. Think when you have that steak on you plate picture that poor cow staring at you i feel so bad. But that is my opinion about it.
I love meat and I love veggies. Why can't I eat them both? And those of you who think that vegetables are oh, so healthy for you – have you ever seen the chemicals that are get sprayed on the vegetables AND the fruit when not grown organically? I doubt that is extending my life – actually it may be contributing to cancer and other diseases. Too bad the whole world does/can not grow organically. I understand both sides, but like many of you, I say – let me eat my steak.... OR let me eat my veggies IN PEACE.
PEACE OUT!
Every vegan I know is a retard. Enough said.
I'm sure some of you meat-eaters will also feel very comfortable eating meat of lower level human-beings.
Going vegetarian (or vegan) is the way to go because you are healthier and can enjoy life more plus being vegetarian can help to extend your life.
My Dear Vegans – hope it works out for you. None of your arguments convince me that I should change my diet. For example, even if we ended all ranching in this country it would not result in more food or water for the third world – we're not going to grow crops on grazing land and we're not going to ship water to the third world. As to the moral rights of animals, I simply don't share your sentiment that evolution should be tossed in the name of "enlightenment". Do I agree with you that cruelty should be eliminated from food production? Yes, and I pay more to get cage free eggs, free range meats etc. In the end almost all of the arguments from vegans come down to subjective opinions and conjectures – since your convinced have at it, I'm not and will continue to enjoy the privileges of being an omnivore on the top of the food chain.
Yes, biologically, we are capable of being omnivores, and an omnivorous diet was essential for our social and cultural development, but we no longer do most of the things our primitive ancestors did, so that argument is meaningless. The simple fact is that eating meat is supporting unnecessary killing. If you knew a cannibal family who lived down the street, you'd probably either try to convince them to quit eating humans, or report them to the authorities. Or perhaps you would tell the media, or organize a group of fellow citizens to protest in front of their house. In short, most of you would do something similar to what we "preachy vegetarians" do - that is, try to correct a moral wrong.
If you eat meat, I am much less concerned about violating your "right" to eat carcasses than I am stopping you from violating the right to life of approximately 93 animals per year (on average).
You can't consider yourself an animal lover or an environmentalist if you eat meat, nor can be be too concerned about those in this world who don't have fresh water or enough to eat - because you are taking their share with your habits.
Leonardo da Vinci, Einstein, Aristotle - all vegetarians. Not a coincidence.
It may not be a coincidence, but it's not really proof of anything either. Citing anecdotal evidence of a few great thinkers that didn't eat meat doesn't really mean anything. It doesn't lend credence to the issue any more than if I were to cite the fact that Hitler was also a vegetarian.
Except he wasn't....
I am sure you can cite other less than admirable vegetarians as well, but if you look at the lives of these three men and their common interest in studying and understanding the world we live in - and in finding order in this world, it is not surprising that they all came to the same conclusion about the best diet for humans. It is is the only diet that makes sense, especially considering the dangerously destructive effects of the meat industry on our resources.
Well it doesn't matter if he was or wasn't. Nor does it matter if Aristotle or anybody else was. That's my whole point. But since you're arguing the point that I'm arguing doesn't matter....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler%27s_vegetarianism
I get your point, Noah, and I agree that the diets of geniuses and dictators are mostly irrelevant. But I'm bored at work and have nothing else to do but argue with you about Hitler:)
http://michaelbluejay.com/veg/hitler.html
I am so sick of vegans being labeled as preachy. We are just trying to prevent you from destroying life on earth.
obviously, the flesheaters are sensitive to their stomachs and could care less about the future of this planet. I too, like so many others,ate meat before I was enlightened and learned the truth. Don't be close minded, it makes you seem so shallow and ignorant. Is that preachy, AMEN Brother
To all you morons flaming people and asking them to 'grow up' and realise we're at the top of the food chain, who says we are? (directed in particular to Matt) Sharks are carnivores and predators and are designed to eat other fish. Do some research and you'll find we're not actually designed to eat meat, we have digestive systems closer to herbivores, do you consider primates to be at the top of the food chain? Don't forget what we've evolved from. We are not at the top of the food chain, we just like to believe we are and use this to justify the senseless murder of millions of animals in intolerable conditions. You grow up, and educate yourself a little.
watch animal plantet.. you get to watch chimps and bonobos hunting monkeys for meat... so yes, they are meat eaters.. we are Omnivores
http://www.vegsource.com/news/2009/11/the-comparative-anatomy-of-eating.html
I would never eat with her. I don't even really watch her show (except for certain clips online), because of the extremist vegetarian attitude.
We get it, you're an animal activist. Well, so am I, in my own way. I work with reptile and amphibian rescues, animals most of you so-called activists barely acknowledge and almost couldn't care less about. I do a lot of education work on them and I am known to be pretty fierce in my defense of them, and taking proper care of them. However, I don't protest people eating frog legs, or iguana meat. Why? Because I do work so closely with them, I don't see them for more or less than they are.
Most of the really fanatical vegan animal activists are people who might own a dog or a cat or a couple of other pets, but have no first hand knowledge of farming or working with animals usually used for meat. They see animals as these idealized Bambi figures with the intelligence of humans, the same thoughts and feelings as humans, oppressed by uncaring people. Then they see meat eaters as these evil killers with no other motive but to cause harm to their poor innocent Bambi beasts.
I am for treating all animals humanely and keeping them as happy as they possibly can be, but I don't delude myself that they are anything more than they are. And I don't appreciate people who do fantasize that they are idyllic figures treating me badly in return.
I respect those who choose to be vegetarian for any reason, and I like vegetarian food. But people like her drive me completely nuts. I respect your choice, now respect mine, and respect my intelligence. Don't proceed to tell me how wrong and horrible I am for being an informed consumer and not making the same choice you did.
Also, stop using wild hyperbole and awful descriptions to try to prove your point. I can tell you things about your precious vegetables that would make you really sick. You think telling me I murdered an animal, or I'm eating it's rotting flesh will change how I see it. Actually, all you're doing is making yourself look like an uninformed sensationalist.
your sir, are a Flexitarinan as well http://flexitariandad.blogspot.com/
Jane,You ignorant slut. Meat is the essence of the earth. From what I have read you fancy the tongue. Bon Appetit!
This is proof that Jane is a meat eater.Julia would not lie to me.
Let's say all of us meat eaters quit eating meat. Wouldn't logic dictate that more food would be required for the animals since there would likely be more of them since we aren't killing them. What will happen to all the cows, they would majically disappear? Or would we end up paying a hefty fee for animal contraceptives. Where would all these animals live?
Also, wouldn't there be more gaseous fumes in the air if less animals are killed and eaten. I can tell you the deer population in Pennsylvania is a growing problem. Next, we would have to drive 20 mph everyone in order to avoid the mass of deer.
Buzz, There wouldn't be so many animals living in horrible conditions and releases massive amounts of methane and dirty water if they weren't raised for human consumption. And it is unlikely they would procreate much on their own, since so many of them are so sick anyway. This isn't a reason to keep eating meat.
If you want to look at it from a Biblical perspective which I know most of you don't.
Here it is anyway.
Genesis 9:1-4
"1 Then God blessed Noah and his sons, saying to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. 2 The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. 3 Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything.
4 "But you must not eat meat that has its lifeblood still in it."
Before the Flood they ate just Vegetation, after that because the flood wrecked the earth and the vegetation and it would not produce like it once had, God in his infinite wisdom made it where eating animals would make up for what you were going to be missing from plants.
Now I myself have tried the Vegan style for one month like all you people say to try. I will tell you now that my testing was done differently from all of yours. I do not take vitamin supplements or anything else other than what I grow/cook. Therefore I do not take a multivitamin or anything like that to boost energy like most of you probably do. Strictly going off of what I ate I had less energy and was almost hospitalized because of nutrient deficiencies. And before you try to say I did it wrong I had someone who is a vegan with me the whole time making sure I was doing it right. They are also now an ex vegan and don't have to pop as many pills to keep themselves going.
What you all seem to be missing is the fact that with out any other supplements you would die because you are missing vital nutrients that your system needs. So I have just provided you with two reasons why what you say is wrong and proven whether you believe the bible or not I have provided it and also a personal testimony from what happens when you do that.
And for the rest of you trying to make a case calling people names makes your point invalid no matter how much research or thought you have put into it.
Actually, you wont die, if done properly, you can get almost, if not everyting you need, from your diet. you need to know what your doing.. and the vegans and veggies are good at that.
your sir, are a Flexitarinan as well http://flexitariandad.blogspot.com/
Oh thanks so much Jane! The standard American Diet (SAD) is killing Americans! We humans are not designed for eating animals and we must get back to that. There is NO physiological reason to eat animals or their secretions. It is not only cruel but totally unhealthy. If everyone had to kill their own pig at the checkout stand, they would not be able to take home the bacon! Goveg.com Stop cruelty, help your own health and save the planet from mountains of manure going into our water systems!
Linda, First the whole ,"Human where not designed to eat meat " thing is a big goober. All upper primates have been know to hunt and eat , it has be documented . humans do eat meat, they derive nutrition from meat, and find it very desireable ( most of us anyway) , Stop with the myths
Yes we are designed to eat meat. In fact, if you go completely Vegan, you have to design your diet carefully and usually take vitamin supplements to make up for the lack. If you want to stay healthy.
But please tell me more about how the entire human race has gotten this wrong for centuries until you came along and suddenly got it right.
Finally, she states that humans make their kids like meat after they force the kids to eat it even when they “Naturally” reject it.. Well I don’t know about you, but I raised 4 kids and if I did not make my kids eat everything they”naturally rejected” they would be eating only potato chips and chicken nuggets. So according to that logic, eating greens and fruits would be un-natural to eat too.
http://flexitariandad.blogspot.com/
, I have no moral dilemma eating a pig, a cow, and “GASP” veal. I truly believe all animals were putt on this earth to be eaten by something or someone, .. So trying to make me feel guilty is far from genius. And I am very pro Veggie, a real sympathizer for the cause and her argument turns in to the Charlie Brown “Waaa waaaa waaaa waa wa waa waa” for me
Restated, her augment looks like this to the meaties. "I challenge the idea that anyone can eat meat 'in peace.' It’s a contrablab blab in terms. How bla blab la bla b la blabb blab la.. bla Blood?
Her very good points become lost on the ears of the very people she is trying to convince, at this point she is preaching only to the choir. A useless Endeavour if you ask me.
I have one meal a day where I avoid meat, and I avoid going overboard the other meals except for special occasions, but saying I am a murderer because I choose to eat a "rotting hunk of flesh" rather then some fried squash makes me want to go grill the biggest steak I can find for dinner.
your sir, are a Flexitarinan http://flexitariandad.blogspot.com/
"I would much rather devour a piece of well-seasoned squash than a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass.” Really ???, I know that I don’t eat rotting meat, but when you tell me I do, because you don’t eat meat, then your well articulated, well meaning words to save the world turn in to Blaa Blaa Blaa with a more irritating tone than Charlie Brown’s teacher.. Period, no argument. You became a whack job. You insulted me.
A Non-Meatie telling a Meat eater not to eat meat because it’s bad is akin to a preacher telling me sex involving non-missionary position is evil and I am a Hell bound sinner getting ready to take a endless molten sulfur bath as soon as I “arrive” . Not that I am invalidating anyone’s religious beliefs and moral constructs,( veggie or religious) but if you want me to fall in line with your line of thinking, you got to sell it to me, not force it with gross comparisons and hyperbole!
What’s a shame is she makes some points that should be considered, even if you don’t wholly agree.
We are fat, as Americans we head the parade of jiggles and dimples, reducing our consumption of meats and dairy would not be a bad thing at all, some would even benefit greater by going pure all out Veggie, but Ms. Mitchell seems to put the whole fat issue down to meat. We are also lazy, sedentary couch slugs, more interested in the TV or Xbox than our health, all the while eating our mega processed foods and high fructose corn syrup ( Corn chips fried in veg oil with a can of coke for a drink are just as unhealthy as Mitchell’s rotting beef carcass, yet no meat in those) .
Not to mention that sugars and simple carbs are turned into body fat MUCH faster and easier than actual fat. Many people actually gain weight when they become vegetarians because instead of focusing on healthful veggies, they replace the meat with more grains- usually pasta and/or white rice. One more reason to do thorough research and meal planning before making a major diet change in whichever direction.
"Uuuuh, you should eat meat because it tastes good.... and it's what everyone else is doing...." -Tim. Gee, thanks Tim, that was enlightening, I'm going to go have a burger now. (rolls eyes)
well, right off the bat, again, you can take this entire debate back to our own overpopulation!!
Wonder why there are millions starving around the world, why we have to have meat factories to meet the demand, why our pollution levels are so high, there are just way too many of us greedy humans on this planet consuming!
So, for those out there that buy horrible cheap processed food to feed your 6 kids that you cant really afford, here's a news flash, stop reproducing, that alone puts the demand at a lower number and reduces the amount of food we have to produce.
Either way, I have no kids of my own, just my adopted ones, we all eat meat, and love it, and tons of fruit and veggies, we purchase everything from small local farms!! THe human race has destroyed this planet! And all other creatures on it will suffer due to us!
Question #3 is my favorite:
Tim – Vegetarians can be preachy
Jane – 7 paragraph rant about how Tim is wrong
You sure showed him...
The responses to each item is exactly what Tim Love is talking about when he says "imagine a restaurant full of preachy vegetarians." She is living up to the exact stereotype that the article is trying to dispel.
Humans who eat animals are just like animals. Humans should not be eating animals, period. It is not natural. It is a bad habit that has continued over time. I am sure that if everyone had to kill, cut, clean and cook their own cow or pig or chicken or lamb, there would be very few meat eaters left in this world. Why is it that meat eaters don't like it if you discuss the slaughter process at the dinner table - THEY CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!
I hate it when people say eating meat is not natural.
First, our bodies process meat and we get essential nutrients from it. If it wasn't natural, we'd be like iguanas, unable to process any animal protein properly. We'd all die of renal failure at the age of around 5, due entirely to diet.
Second, I love how vegans say this, as their movement is only a few decades old, and humankind is centuries old, and almost every instance of man from the very beginning of archeological evidence has eaten meat. If it wasn't natural, it would be the meat movement that's only decades old, and vegetarians would have dominated human history.
Humans can live on a diet of only vegetables. That doesn't mean that it's our natural state. And that doesn't mean that you should try to scare people into eating only vegetables with facts you made up to prove a point.
When you eat meat, you are ingesting into your body the horrble energy of the soul of the innocent animal that just experienced being slaughtered. That negative energy stays with you. You are also eating whatever the animal ate - bugs, rats, dirt, poop....
Very strong article, with ample evidence and FACTS, which was missing in Tim Love's tirade. CNN you have redeemed yourself :)
"Babies turn away from the taste of meat"? This broad is nuts. She doesnt (nor ever) will have kids so how does she know? Anyway, I respect a person's right to be vegetarian. But Im not one so if you you a problem with it then kiss my ass! Look human may be animals but guess what...plenty of animals eat meat. Would you idiots really been more happy with me if i chased down a cow and ripped its throat out with my teeth rather than bought a steak from a store? I'll stop eating meat when lions do. And yes lions would cook their meat if they had the intellegence...and thumbs
lions do not stack their prey in tiny boxes, and they only eat what they need, people are greedy and eat way too much meat, why do you think everyones fat? from eating cheeseburgers....you disgusting pig
B*Tch get over yourself!...Im 5'9 & 130 pounds, lmao- seriously go kill yourself
Damn girl,I want to sell tickets to that event. It would be bigger than the "Thrilla in Manila"! Let me know as I"m gettin my hair brushed out right now!
Jane Velez Mitchell is a hero for speaking out about the dark corners of our culture that other people don't want to touch. As Paul McCartney said, if slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be vegetarian or vegan. So much needless, incredibly cruel abuse is going on every day. Cutting meat from your diet is the best thing you can do for animals, the environment, and your own health. Thank you Jane for giving a voice to the voiceless.
Do you really know if the bird that you bought is a chicken, what if it was a crow or raven? After the bird is skinned everything looks the same.
To be honest all of yall are on some ignorant type mindsets, while you are busy bashing on each other about who eats what, wars are being fought, education is slowly falling apart and children are starving all over the world (I doubt they are thinking about whether they eat meat or vegetables). Get your priorities in order.
stop wasting your time telling people not to waste their time on a blog...you've obviously got bigger things to worry about you sad sack
Thank you Jane for such valid and honest reasons to be vegan. As usual the argument is reduced down to just "taste". I don't eat animals, or their secretions and I LOVE my food! Delicious and healthy – No problems with the "yummy" factor at all!
I run 2 miles every other day yet I end up with 2 black eyes because I have "Man Boobs" Please Help Me Jane!
the soy bean will eventually be the main source of protein for humans....with time and education my friends
I'm sorry to break this to you, but that is highly unlikely. Soy is a potent goiterogen- meaning that it suppresses the thyroid. We already have a epidemic in the US of people who have underactive thyroids, and the only way to neutralize the goiterogenic effect of soy is to ferment it. That means traditionally fermented soy sauce (rare), miso, stinky tofu (fermented tofu), and a handful of other products that are not common outside of Asia.
On top of that, the trypsin inhibitors in soy prevents proper digestion of protein (from any source), the phytates prevent proper absorption of calcium, magnesium, copper, iron and zinc. The phyto-estrogens can actually screw up your hormonal balance and is one of the worst things to eat for those who have a hormonal imbalance.
Soy is also highly allergenic, and the fact that approximately 90% of the US soy crops are GMO (and among the most heavily sprayed crops) only increases this. Sprouted soy, unlike most grains and legumes, actually increases many of the negatives. There are some reports that indicate that there are more people who are allergic to soy than to any other food, though you may be pleased to hear that soy fed to chickens will remain in the yolk of the egg making many believe that they are allergic to eggs when they are, in fact, allergic to the soy or corn that is fed to the chickens (which is one reason that I pay more for pastured eggs).
If your body is able to thrive on soy, then I'm very happy for you. But this is not the case for many, many people. Much better would be that neat grain combining trick (assuming that the combiner is not allergic to gluten or another grain that is involved), particularly if the grains are properly prepared (soaked or sprouted to reduce phytic acid).
Loved this article. Reading it really made me realize that I am doing a good job in staying vegetarian. Go Jane !!! Totally agree with you :)
I love all these ignorant comments from the meat eaters who think ALL humans who live on the planet reside in the US. Most people in the world do not eat eggs&bacon for breakfast, a chicken sandwich for lunch and a pork chop for dinner. They eat meat 1-2 a WEEK in small portions because it's so expensive. In many countries soup, rice, beans, vegetables with a variety of spices are food staples.
That's a fact!
True, but in most of these countries, they also eat meat. Not in such great quantities, but they have no problems eating meat when it's available and they can afford it. Just because it isn't a staple, doesn't mean its absent from their diets by choice.
Well the same typical BS comments from most of the people who post here as the 'chef'. What's worse is that you disagree with her by adding insults, calling her a broad, a lesbian, and more. The only ones who carry this discussion as an argument are those who think it's their god-given right to kill another being to survive. Get over yourselves. The pollution from farms is horrible. They ruin our ground water, change the acidity levels in the soil, and we have to put up with the smell when it swath the crap over the fields. Which is another great point. Farmers insist that they have to spread the shit to keep the land fertile. Not true. Proper rotation of crops keeps the ground fertile, not excrement.
So lets get this straight. You meat lovers out there. Don't eat vegetables, fruits, legumes, grains, or anything else. Then tell me how good you will feel in 5 days, 10, then 30. You cannot survive in ketosis. Tim Love is an idiot of a chef for saying the things he did even though it sounds like he's 'okay' with vegetables. Obviously a redneck, and obviously feels the need to make a dead animal part of every meal. What he doesn't explain is that if you do eat meat, you only need 2-3 ounces twice per week. That's about 1.5" diameter piece. The amount of energy and food used to raise something to take to the inhumane slaughter houses is horrendous, and anyone who is somewhat concerned about the state of humanity or even the planet would know that this is not a way to sustain life.
My second to last point: Our teeth are signs that we are not meat eaters as they are designed for breaking down the fibres of plants, and out digestive system does have the ability to break down and digest animal proteins efficiently. That's why people feel tired and bloated after a meal.
For people who think the way someone of you do, and your comments prove it, you should be walked though a slaughter house, have to kill your own food, and process it. It's a well known fact that most people would not be eating animal protein if they had to do that.
That last thing that you said..about having to kill and process the animal yourself...it exactly what tipped me over the edge into vegetarianism. I love animals and I could never ever kill one. Horrendous! Since I switched over, I have never felt better in my entire life and it shows. All the little aches and pains...gone. Energy level..WAY UP! Best of all, my conscience is clear and I feel entirely at peace and content.
Bring on the hate people. I stated my own personal feelings. :)
will you marry me
LOL@Soy Brings Me Joy
I'm not sure which one of us you were asking..LOL I am very happily married. It sounds like you are a caring and loving soul who will no doubt find someone to make you very happy.
Lack of facts on lack of facts.
We do digest meat properly. If you feel bloated after a meal, it's because you ate too much, not because you ate meat. The same happens after a hearty meal of green beans and soy, if you eat too much. Portion control is an issues for vegetarians and meat eaters.
Our teeth are not evidence that we are only supposed to eat vegetables. Our teeth are designed to be omnivorous. We can chew our meat, vegetables, even hard things like nuts, with no trouble. Our teeth are not razor sharp because we do not hunt with them. We kill with tools, cook the meat, and eat with tools. There is no need for our teeth to be those of a shark.
I don't mind a good argument with a well informed person debating the opposite side, but it's not right sling about made up facts like this. There are a lot of reasons to go vegetarian. Use economic reasons, or reasons of compassion, or something that makes a modicum of sense.
I don't eat that much meat, because I just don't like it! The same as someone who won't each veggies, seafood, etc. It's just the taste factor for me. Sometimes, it just doesn't want to go down easy. It always has to be a very thin slice of beef or small pieces of chicken...don't give me a large chicken breast...hate it. People ask me if I'm a vegetarian, because I hardly ever order meat in a restaurant and I always feel I have to defend myself, but I tell them...no, I just don't like the taste of meat. I never did, even as a child...yuck!! It has nothing to do with morals or anything else. Just don't like it!
Jane. Thanks. We need a world filled with people like you and what a better place it would be.
Ack, sorry, meant to say... "I'm not 100% vegetarian, and certainly *not* vegan..."
Both of these articles are sensationalistic - first the carnivore cowboy chef tells us vegetarians are stupid because meat tastes better (a matter of opinion). Then the self-righteous vegan tells us we should not eat meat or animal by-products because it's mean to the animals (true, but most habitual meat eaters care nothing about cruelty to animals, so that argument falls on deaf ears).
Ms. Velez-Mitchell talks almost entirely about how cruel to the animals it is to eat factory-farmed meat. Nothing about free-range or organically grown meat.
Mr. Love at least makes a passing mention of dietary & health concerns, although he wrongly suggests that you can eat a lot of meat with no health worries as long as you don't go to extremes. Show me a guy with a huge gut and I'll show you a meat eater. Show me a woman with a rear end the size of a VW and I'll show you a meat eater. (True, these people also probably eat way too many simple carbohydrates, but I guarantee you they eat meat.)
I'm not 100% vegetarian, and certainly vegan, but I eat meat or fish only 2 or 3 times a week on average. Like most Americans, I ate meat 2 or 3 times a day for many years. Since eating more vegetables and way less meat, I don't get sick as often, I've lost weight and kept it off, and my energy level is better. I also have kept my "bad" cholesterol level in the healthy range by eating less saturated fat, less simple carbohydrates, more fiber - and by exercising more.
Question for all you middle-aged frequent meat eaters: How many of you are on Lipitor? I thought so.
I love your argument that all fat people are meat eaters. Too bad it has no basis in fact. I personally know die-hard VEGANs who are obese. Just because you only eat vegetables doesn't mean you have self control and are eating correctly. Just because you eat meat does not mean you are eating non-stop and have high cholesterol.
Calm down. OK, so it's possible for a "vegan" to be obese, if they subsist mainly on bread, Cheetos, and beer and never exercise. I don't know any vegans like that - the ones I know are all health conscious. You obviously know some "outliers" who are not in the statistical norm for vegans.
BTW, as I said, I eat meat myself. In moderation.
I enjoy meat, and I would hope that those producing the meat could do so within reasonable standards to get the vegetarians off our backs about it. We will be raising our own pigs next year hopefully, and we hunt/get venison during the winter. My father in law is an avid fisherman, so they have a freezer full of that for us too. Meat itself is not bad, it is good for you and is a necessary part of your nutrition. I will agree that we don’t need quite as much of it and we could all benefit from putting more vegetables in our diets, but to say that we shouldn’t be eating meat at all is ridiculous.
One thing vegan zealots forget to mention is how much hunters and fishermen do for the environment. My grandfather was an avid deer hunter and a great steward of the land.
Hats off to you and your family for raising your own animals and eating locally caught fish and game.
“(Lisa) “I’m going to become a vegetarian” (Homer) “Does that mean you’re not going to eat any pork?” “Yes” “Bacon?” “Yes Dad” Ham?” “Dad all those meats come from the same animal” “Right Lisa, some wonderful, magical animal!”"
Pork Chops and Bacon, my two favorite animals!
The 'study' that found more animals die from a vegan diet is now completely debunked, after it was found all the figures were wrong. Check your facts please people...
well....you don't kill plants..you eat the fruits/vegetables given by the plants...you keep growing the plants with sunshine and water which helps the environment...and in turn it produces more fruits and vegetables....plants don't have death as long as it gets sunshine and water and nobody razes it and there are no natural disasters.....anything that has a heart and bleeds when hurt and cannot reproduce after 'death' are essentially killed....plants can reproduce even after fruits/vegetables are 'killed' and produces even more fruits and vegetables with water and sunshine...(repeat post as it got buried elsewhere...)
Eating eggs also doesn't kill the animals that produce them, but even this bothers vegans–even though morally I don't see any difference between eggs and fruit (they're both reproductive creations of living things, and both create, if left alone, other living things). And plants and grains are killed all the time, for various reasons, and also by most herbivores that have no compunction about the distinction between the plants or it's products.
I agree that eggs have been proven to be vegetarian...although i dont like to eat it as i hate the smell...i also agree that a lot of vegetarians may not be as planet-conscious or plant-conscious as they are supposed to be as a result of which more damage is done to the crops...but at the same time, these things pale in comparison to the amount of meat consumed, especially in the US....
Would someone trim my beard please? I'm getting a Presidential Pardon next month.
I have never really been good enough at anything to be arrogant. So I am considering becoming a vegan, just so I can have a reason to walk around acting like I am better than everyone else. I think that will be fun. I'm sure that attitude will encourage more people to be open minded and try veganism.
You sound just like me citizen! Lpw 5 on that one.
We eat more meat because we are the richest nation on earth and our technological advances enable us to produce large quantities of meat at affordable prices. They aren't eating as much meat in say... Nigeria because they can't afford it, not because they don't want it.
Rotting carcass? Give me a break… that carrot you are gnawing on is technically rotting too!
Factoring farming run-off?? Last time I checked pesticides and herbicides were a significant contributor to this run-off you speak of. And ditto on the rain forest clearing, lots of crops being planted in those freshly cleared parcels.
Tofurky – Yea taste as good as it sounds I bet. So this year you are having a dead vegetable front and center?
Gestation Cages??? Have you ever seen how they pack those potatoes into those terrible trailers? Then send them floating into the processing facility in that turbulent water? That has to be stressful for the potato! Sounds like they are protecting the pigs from predators to me! ;-) They can put them in a dress and make em wear lipstick for all I care… I’ll have the pork chop please!
It's really obnoxious how many people seem to attack her womanhood first and her point second. Let's focus people.
With that said, stuff like this is part of the reason I took so long to become a vegetarian. I find her argument preachy and I'd like to see the sources she got her "facts" from. However, I also found the first article about why NOT to be a vegetarian preachy and annoying.
My decision to be a vegetarian was personal and MY decision. Just like the decision to continue eating meat.
I could not finish reading this. I was disgusted by the attitudes on both sides! An elitist attitude from one side and an arrogant inconsiderate attitude from the other. They both need to grow up.
I do not agree with or condone the industrialization of animals for food...
but I do agree with and condone that eating meat is AWESOME!!! Is it okay for a "family farm" to raise just enough livestock to feed that one family and maybe a friend or two?
You can have my pork chop when you pull it from my dead over dosed protein hands!
This whole aurgment that somehow the farm animals are suffering because of the consumption of meat is ludicrous. Yes there are inhumane people but it has nothing to do with meat consumption (anyone remember Michael Vick). If people didn't raise meat for consumption, most of these animals would not even exist. None of them are able to survive in the wild because they have been selectively bred to remove those characteristics which enabled them to fight or flee. Most would starve to death, or would be hunted and eaten by wild predators. Oh, how humane.
Right....because existing soley to be kept in deplorable conditions and mistreated is better than not existing? Give me a break. Speak for yourself, not the animals.
I thought CNN would have more credibility than letting this elitist talk...
Colin, thank-you, thank-you. But unfortunately, vegetarians/vegans think they are smarter, better educated and "more moral" than us meat eating thugs! Just read the blogs. What is this great country of our's coming to? I don't agree with you, and I'm evil? I eat meat and I'm a murderer? Has everyone lost their minds? Once again, I thought America was about choice, the choice to choose your own options in life, work hard and love other's as you would love yourself. Hello? Hello? Anybody out there remember?
The choice to murder, you mean? Loving everyone except animals, then?
Or loving animals while digesting another piece of their flesh?
Astounding.
People need to to stop encouraging people like Valez-Mitchell to go to DC and stand up for their moronic beliefs, that how we got the idiots that are there now.
From an evolutionary standpoint, there is a reason not all of our teeth are for grinding like a cow's. We have incisors to tear with. That is for meat-eating by design. Hey, if you want to be a vegetarian/vegan, then good for you. I'm just pointing out the obvious.
Bravo, Charles Darwin Jr.! This is the most convoluted argument I have ever heard: "meat-eating by design". Enjoy your steak and lobsters. Why don't you try eating dogs and cats and squirrels and mice and rats; they could be delicious. Go hunt for them because they are not available at food stores; you have teeth that can devour these animals.
I would eat all those, but you need to eat a heck of a lot of mice to make it worth while. Maybe as an appetizer?
Who is this broad? Stupid, stereotypical, arrogant argument for being vegetarian. I have nothing against vegetarians, but if they all have arguments like this...
Sure you can make friends with salad, Chicken Caesar Salad, Chickhen Salad, Shrimp Salad, Taco Salad, Chef Salad, Tuna Salad, and there are probably many others.
Touche
We have been vegetarian for a little over 3yrs. I am wondering, why does one *need* a political reason to do something that they want to do? We eat what we like to eat. We just would rather eat vegetarian fare than meat. I will not feel guilty over the food I enjoy. Likewise, I think it is shamefully rude to try to guilt someone into doing or not doing something. Whether they eat meat or veg or both. Let. people. enjoy. their. meal.
If you feel this strongly Jane Valez-Mitchell then please stop whining about the injustice, get off your laptop, go to D.C. and do something about it. I guess another way to put it would be stop trying to drain the tub one drop at a time. And sorry, the excuse of "it's not my job" is a bit threadbare at this point. If you won't do something about it shut the ^%&*( up.
Ms. Velez-Mitchell's arguments are all about factory-farming practices. If that were the only type of meat that were available to eat then yes, she would have a point. However, since there are also sustainable farms out there that produce free-range, healthy, organic meat, I have trouble following her logic. Vegetarian or factory-farmed meat are not the only two choices that exist. There is a whole spectrum of meat products in the middle that she is choosing to ignore in order to make her point. If we could get the country to abandon it's factory-farming practices and go back to real, sustainable farming as the norm (no more stacked cages, no more antibiotics, no more growth hormones) we would solve a lot of the problems that she is talking about without having to make everyone become a vegetarian. It's all about moderation and responsible farming practices.
I'd just like to point out... "you don't make friends with salad"
"You don't make friends with salad".
Yeah, that unseasoned, bloody and hardly warm chunk of meat served hardly did the trick either. I'm glad you found the knob to turn on the stove.
FYI, iceburg lettuce, half a tomato, and two raw onion rings does not constitute "salad".
Veggies make me retch. Literally. I can't get them past my tastebuds. I wish I could eat them, because then it would be easier to lose weight. (Well, I could eat them, then throw them up, that would make me lose weight.) I don't eat a lot of meat, but it isn't because I can't eat something with a face. I love a good cheeseburger as much as the next meat-lover. Here's what I don't understand – what's wrong with milk and cheese? Nothing dies to make either. Does this mean you don't breastfeed your children? I mean, there's no difference, right? Milk is milk...
My motto: Eat what you want, don't tell anyone else what to eat. Humans are designed for both meat and veggies. Eating just one or the other isn't normal. But if that's what floats your boat, by all means, do what you think is right. Just leave me alone.
Suddenly, you made me think of creating a monstrous milk factory with caged human females being fed hormones to induce lactation. Mmm... Delicious. I mean, milk is milk... There's no difference, right?
God I hate preachy people. If you have an opinion on something fine, but alienate people that don't agree with you. I love meat and what difference does it make how you treat the animal when in the end you are still going to kill and eat it. It's more insulting to be nice to it, then you give them hope you might not kill and eat it. I kill and eat any animal if I had too, shit when starving to death people will eat each other, ever see the movie Alive, which is based on real events. I bet Ms. Velez-Mitchell would take a bit out of Fred if she was starving to death in the Andies. You ain't going to get people to stop eating meat, so deal and stop trying make people that do feel guilty about it, because you are wasting your breath and our time listening to your BS.
Oh to be spoiled for choice.
If everyone stops eating cows what do we do with all the cows? Just let them continue to populate until there is no room left and no grass left?
I hope I didn't miss anything important. I made myself a bacon cheeseburger, using a krispy kreme doughnut for the bun.
Ok. So there are several lines of reasoning on display here among vegetarians/vegans that frankly have never made any sense to me. Either we have a choice (and according to some we're inexplicably the only creatures on the planet that have this choice). Or we're supposed to be of a certain determined nature...i.e, we're "supposed" to be herbivores, or we're supposed to be more evolved, or we're supposed to be better, or we're supposed to be kinder and gentler. So which is it? Do we have a choice, or don't we? This has always struck me as grasping at straws, and the fact that these arguments simultaneously come out of the same people has been a sign to me of the fundamental lack of confidence and knowledge of vegetarians and vegans.
If humans are supposed to be "better" than animals, then we can't very well argue at the same time that they are equal to us either. This argument more than any other is one that has always bothered me. "Animal rights" are an oxymoron. We may condescend to "give" them rights, but true equality would mean that they would need to accede and accept these rights, and, more important, bestow equal rights upon us as well. But in reality this is a one-way equation. That doesn't spell "rights" to me. Think about it: If a man kills a pig, a vegetarian might claim that the man is acting in violation of that animal's "rights" as an equal being. If the pig kills the man, however, would we claim that the pig be destroyed because it has violated the man's "rights" or that it be spared because the pig didn't know what it was doing and was therefore "just being an animal"? There's no right or wrong answer here, and your answer would depend on your politics, but the fundamental ambiguity especially of the vegetarian/vegan response strongly suggests that this is NOT an situation of equality. If vegetarians claim that when animals kill other living things for food these animals are acting approrpriately, but claim that humans doing the same thing are acting inappropriately and "inhumanely", then this is NOT equality and clearly humans and animals are (in the vegetarians' twisted universe) NOT EQUAL. If vegetarians and vegans would condemn humans for killing animals, then morally we must also equally condemn other animals for the same crime. THAT'S equality. The issue of differences between humans and animals in intelligence, conscience, skills, education, and all the rest are irrelevant....just as we don't count those things when judging two humans. We don't consider humans who are smarter, or better educated, or "more moral" to have more rights than other humans (certainly...we would say these things WOULD BE WRONG), so why would we think that humans therefore are better than animals, and must therefore behave BETTER than animals, and yet still claim that humans and animals are equal?
They are equal, but for different reasons than vegetarians and vegans would claim: All living things kill other living things to stay alive. This is not evil. It's life.
all i have to say to all these people who are saying plants don't feel pain is how do you know have you ever been a plant before? You cant believe everything science says cause sometimes its just a theory.
She's not going to win any converts insulting people like that, but this is the internet, where we go to anonymously insult people and get high fives from like-minded strangers. Preach away.
The author needs to educate herself about anthropology a bit and speak from her brain instead of her heart. As an omnivorous species, our brain-size took an upswing when we became able to consume the high amounts of protein that comes from eating meat. Our success as a species was driven by this need and ability to hunt, requiring and providing bigger brains, hairless bodies and bi-pedal locomotion.
If you want to go without eating meat, that's fine, but no need to sit on your high gourd to do so. Why not say "I would much rather devour a slice of well-seasoned fillet mignon than a chunk of rotten black potato"? When you fortify your agenda with information from like-thinking individuals/corporations/societies, you'll often find you're missing half of the story and that most of your talking points come with giant asterisks. This article was factually worthless and should be labeled as "flame-bait".
I'm not even sure this should have gotten space on this website. This isn't a discussion. It's one person (Jane) making lucid, well-thought-out points, and the other person (the inappropriately named Tim "Love") trying to get out of any real analysis of his own behavior by making cheap, tired jokes. We get it, Tim. You have no excuse for killing animals because you like how they taste. Your only recourse is to make jokes about it in the hopes that the din of laughter will cover up your completely vapid "argument." Thanks for chiming in; don't let heart disease hit you on the way out.
He's a braindead redneck. Do you really believe him capable of making valid arguments?
Jane Velez-Mitchell is brilliant and clearly konws more about nutrition and food than Tim Love, whose comments sound shallow and close-minded. I think the vegetarians won on this one.
EAT ME all of you Plant People!
Interesting, and while I admire Ms. Mitchell for her standing up for her convictions, she's blending many issues (humane treatment of animals, global warming, childhood obesity, responsible parenting to name a few) into one (the choice to eat meat or not) and choosing to attack anyone taking a contrary stance to hers on the broader issue. In colloquial terms, she's throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Entering ANY debate in this manner leaves both sides angry and wholly dissatisfied. Rather than blindly attacking anyone who takes a position contrary to hers on the issue of vegetarianism, she could constructively isolate each issue and look for ways to make measurable improvement in some if not all areas. Being a recovering addict she could learn a lot by following one of the mantras of recovery and seek 'progress rather than perfection' and taking things 'one step at a time'.
Quite honestly I thought she brought to light some AMAZING issues that proves, how one decision leads to a slew of other problems. I LOVE pork- but learning about the gestation crates breaks my heart... to see that takes it all to another level, just to eat something that will clog our bodies anyway. *sigh* I gotta pray...
Let's have a feast. Tim make the steaks & Jane make the sides. All you need is love.
Several points/thoughts:
1. "We have been brainwashed into craving a diet that is killing us." That is a completely false statement. A well-rounded diet consisting of a bit of everything does not kill someone – and probably helps them to remain healthy. "Everything in moderation" is not bad for you. By her logic, drinking wine or beer or having a cocktail once in a while can be considered "habits that are killing us." Baloney!
2. And most important…this lady is one of those people who takes herself WAY too seriously. Here's a guy trying to have some fun with a point/counterpoint interview, and she's using it as a pedastal to lambaste the meat industry. This is a ridiculously absurd article because the woman is a loser. And she is using GROSS generalizations about the meat industry and what happens to many of these animals. AND…the point that gets lost in all of this is…the meat industry is providing a service to the fat, stupid, unhealthy overconsumers in this country (and everywhere else in the world, for that matter). If people stop buying fast food, or at least cut their consumption in half, all of a sudden the meat industry has to get smart about how they're raising animals and they have to start improving their processes to accommodate a smarter, healthier consumer. Until that happens, don't blame the meat industry for catering to the public's demand. Just like in every single sector of the economy or in every single profession (financial, pharmaceutical, agriculture, politicians, hell…even professional sports), there are companies/firms/owners/workers who are trying to beat the system…trying to find cheaper, faster ways of making money. It happens all over the place, 24 hours a day. The important thing is with food…you have a choice in what you eat, what you buy, and what you put into your body. If these lousy politicians, who are on the take, start enacting crazy laws (like putting freaking cameras EVERYWHERE), and all of a sudden you don't have a choice in what you do, or what you say, or how you act, THAT is a bigger risk to us as Americans than some meat-packing plants in the mid-west.
Also…she says things like "Ever wonder why we’re experiencing all those salmonella and swine flu outbreaks…" Really? How many are there per year I wonder? AND…I bet the ratio of disease outbreaks to amount of meat "processed" is microscopic, considering how many pounds of meat and dairy is produced every year. The widespread outbreaks are so small in relation to the number of animals in these lots…but we only hear about the outbreaks. Interestingly enough, the media doesn't like to report on all of the millions of pounds of sanitary meat produced…that doesn't make for as eye-popping of a story.
If we all eat meat, then inhumane meat farms will be required to fill demand. If we all go vegan, then finding enough farm land, water, fertilizer, etc. will be problematic and disruptive to the environment. Maybe there are just too many people on this planet. As unpopular as the subject will be for everyone, the world needs to address population control. If it can be done now through a cultural shift (most people decide on their own to have 2 or less kids), then hopefully we can avoid an emergency/epidemic down the line that will require governement control of populations. It would be nice if we all learned to eat a little less (and from more humane sources), but no matter how much we adjust our eating habits, we will still be faced with a food crises at some point if the earth's population continues to grow.
If there were less people on the planet, then we could all eat animals that lived happy, hug-filled lives, or eat plants that were grown in an organic fashion.
Animals have souls too. The spiritual spark of life – the soul – is what gives life to the material body. Without the soul there is no life. Animals eat, drink, mate, defend, feel pain – so many thiings that humans also experience – so it is not logical to say that they have no souls. In the Christian world it is said "Thou shall not kill." So killing is a sin and punishable by the laws of nature, God.
If jyotirmaya das were correct, eating vegetables would be just as bad as eating meat.
I LIKE to eat meat! Also like to smoke alot of CIGS!
And that's the way it is!
This is only 1 reason to not eat meat: ethics. Don't pretend you've got some comprehensive or well reasoned argument here. It all boils down to "I believe it is culturally, environmentally and economically unethical to eat meat"
Here's the facts: Protein from red meat is the reason we are so different from other primates. Protein fuels brain development. Period. If you deprive yourself (or even worse, your children) of meat you are stunting their cognitive development. if you try and compensate with soy you are flooding their bodies with excess estrogen.
I agree that we eat too much meat, and that factory farming is environmentally harmful. But don't you dare sit up there on your high horse and pretend that just because I eat meat I'm somehow not as enlightened as you are. At least I have scientific evidence to back up my beliefs, you only have subjective ethical and moral judgments.
I understand your argument and appreciate that you communicated it thoughtfully and without excessive rancor. However, there exists scientific evidence to support the health benefits of both omnivore and herbivore diets. I don't think there's really a clear-cut answer as to what's the most healthful way to eat. You're right – it's an ethical choice. I choose not to eat meat.
A well-written, non-flammatory post. The internet thanks you!
Go to a slaughterhouse, visit a factory farm, and then tell me how good that steak or bacon tastes. I choose not to eat meat, but I feel it is a personal choice. I do not go around "preaching" against eating meat. However, I do believe that most meat eaters don't fully understand how the meat gets to their plates, nor do they understand the suffering involved. Do a little research, get educated, visit a small farm (most people would be surprised to see how intelligent and affectionate cows are) and then decide. No preaching, just a suggestion.
Velez-Mitchell's head is so far up her ass its not even funny. Want to talk about "preachy"? Look at the vegan bracelet she has on in the picture! That is ridiculous.
Jane's reasons for not eating animals are carefully reasoned and sensible, but the best reason Tim could come up with for eating meat is that bacon tastes good? There are so many reasons to base your diet around healthy plant foods instead of cholesterol-laden animal products. Jane and the countless other vegans out there are living proof that you don't need to eat animals to be healthy or happy.
Keep fighting the good fight, Jane! It is kind of sad to see how much hate and defensiveness a simple article stating an alternate point of view can generate.
She didn't give any good reasons to actually become a vegan. All she pointed out was that the way we treat animals is horrible. If animal rights is important to you buy meat from an ethical farmer. There are lots of those out there. I like meat and tried giving it up once. I lasted about an hour when my friend invited me to a BBQ.
I love this comment "Just in terms of common sense, look at a horse. It eats grass and hay and is extremely muscular and fast. We like to say, "eat around the animal." This is the most misguide comment ever, the horse digestive system allows him to extract all the nutrients from the grass that he needs, plus has anyone ever seeing a horse eat it eats all day massive amounts of grass, for a human to be able to survive on vegetable we'll need to eat massive amounts of vegis, I agreed with the comments that vegetable are good for us humans, but vegan and vegetarian go south is when they say we should eat grains and wheat, a complete and healthy meal for humans is vegetables and grass fed animal protein and fat. If you ever look at a vegan that eats nothing but vegetables fruits and grains, are skinny without any muscle definition because they are lacking the proper protein intake to maintain muscle, you'll need to eat 22 heads of lettuce to get the same nutrition that you'll get from a 6 onces of grass fed Bison I don't know about anyone here I don't want to eat 22 heads of lettuce.
Very heated argument! I agree that the sides are based on two very different views: moral versus palate. Cooked animal flesh actually gets its flavor from plants (seasonings and spices). Raw meat is not palatable. Unless you are a Neanderthal.
I beg to differ. Raw meat is extremely palatable. Sashimi (sushi), rare steaks etc are all quite tasty and if it were not for health concerns, most of my meat would be served to me nearly raw.
It's disheartening to read the smut that people communicate when someone voices their opinion about an issue. Jane has shared FACTS with us, not myths, but many Americans are still in denial about the impact their actions have on the world. There is no judgment here, only an attempt to raise awareness about the horrors of factory farming, the inhumane treatment of animals in our food supply, the impact on US from the overuse of massive amounts of hormones and antibiotics on our meat supply, the environmental waste that continues to wreak havoc on our land, and water supplies, and finally the "i need my meat protein" myth that is perpetuated by those who make money from this horror. Think about this. Every single animal YOU eat, does NOT eat meat to survive. Now how come a 700 pound animal can thrive on a vegetarian diet but we think WE cannot?? Sadly, it's been said that humans will never change until the pain of remaining as they are outweighs the pain of change. Tick tock people.
Because humans lack the enzymes to metabolize cellulose.
It amazes me the number of people who have commented on this article without actually taking ANYTHING about it seriously. We Americans value the freedom to choose our food as much as we value our freedom to say, think, do, and feel pretty much whatever we want, and it becomes an emotional free-for-all. I'm a newly-"converted" vegetarian, and I'm slowly (but surely!) making my way toward the vegan end of the spectrum. I used to drink a gallon of milk and eat a pound of cheese each week, eat a chicken breast each night, a burger when there wasn't any chicken, and eggs every morning. Then I discovered how cruelly we treat the animals whose lives we create and take just to have a meal – a meal that will eventually kill us before our time, if you want to be honest. I have no qualms with eating meat and animal products; as many of you have pointed out, it has been a part of our "natural" diet since humans were able to hunt – we have canine teeth for a reason. But where has the respect gone? We've "always" eaten meat and animal products, yes, but we've come so far from that origin that we no longer RESPECT the animals from whom we take the only things they have: their flesh, bones, and their LIVES. Like we have our canine teeth for a reason, we have our RATIONALITY for a reason. Were humans meant to eat meat? Yes. But were those animals we kill for that meat meant to live in filthy, crowded pens and stalls with no fresh air, no sunlight, and standing in their own manure? I'd say a big "HELL NO." They weren't meant to eat corn, either, or be fed antibiotics at every single meal of their lives. Chickens weren't meant to be de-beaked so they don't hurt or kill each other, simply so factory farms can pack thousands more animals into a "house" to turn a profit. Pigs weren't meant to be ripped from their families (yes, they do maintain family structures in the wild) or live in such over-populated conditions that the sows "have" to be kept in gestation crates so as to avoid trampling their young – if the animals were too dumb to keep from squishing their own babies, their species probably wouldn't exist anymore anyway. Cows weren't meant to be kept lactating for basically their entire lives WITHOUT a calf to drink their milk, and they CERTAINLY weren't meant to be rammed with iron rods in their genital and oral orifices by the factory farm workers that have grown sadistic because of the conditions of their workplace (yes, it does happen, and it happens a LOT). Did you know that the chicken breasts we're served at restaurants and by the grocery stores are from chicks – not even adult birds – that are only weeks old? Thank growth hormones and antibiotics we force-feed them. Did you know that male chicks, because they're not considered "usable" by the factory farming industry, are often tossed LIVE into a wood-chipper? Thank the need for factory farms to profit. Did you know that the runoff produced by factory farms (think: animal feces contaminated with antibiotics and bacteria like e-Coli) contaminates groundwater in the cities and towns nearby, rendering that water undrinkable? Thank loose rules and regulations and very large loopholes in containment requirements.
Like I said, I think humans were meant to eat meat. At least some. By no means were we meant to consume the large amounts of animal products that we do today, and the ever-rising rates of obesity and cardiac conditions in our country are testament to that. Humans have always eaten meat, but they've always eaten a mostly plant-based diet on top of it. Hunter-gatherers were mostly gatherers, and often the hunters were unsuccessful. That's one of the reasons humans began agriculture. Vegetables, grains, and fruit have every nutrient in them that the human body needs to survive – and, wouldn't you know it, eating a diet high in these helps ward off obesity, infections, and diseases such as cancer. So yes, we were meant to eat meat, in small portions and only occasionally, and most definitely not via the horrors of the factory farm system.
Please, educate yourself. You'll help save thousands, maybe millions of lives over the course of your single lifetime – and one of them may be your own.
For those of you who use the argument, "The plants feel pain, too," please note that plants have no nervous systems. I've been a vegan for 20 years–68 and going fine.
OK, I have to pull this apart. The arguments are WEAK. I'll go by group.
1) Really? Some kids don't initially like meat therefore it must be bad us? Some kids don't like vegetables. Others would eat candy all the time if they could. The idea that a child's initial inclinations are more in tune with our nature is silly. It's the idea that the Id knows best. It doesn't. Take that out of your argument and the rest is fine.
2) That's just gross. You win this round, I won't eat any more bacon.
3) A-you're being a preachy vegan B- you argue that if farmers weren't selling food to livestock farmers they would continue to produce at the same volumes but just give it away to the hungry for free? Can I live on your planet?
4) He said IN MODERATION & your opening argument is "huge amounts of protein". Pay attention.
5) I really have nothing to say about this, both sides are fine with me. I think the "celebrate life" comment, while nice, is rather hokey, but I'll let you have it.
I've been a vegetarian for 4 years and never looked back. I don't eat meat because I think it is disgusting to eat other animals who form friendships and mourn the loss of loved ones, just like I do. Each animal has its own personality, and when you eat an animal, you are eating an individual. This might not be enough for someone to choose to go veg, but it was enough for me. If you want to eat meat, that is fine. But just know that you are responsible for the killing of innocent creatures who want nothing more than to live in peace with their friends and families.
I, personally, think both these people are two sides of the spectrum. You got this Texan chef whose just all "yeehaw" about tearing into the flesh of another animal and then you got this vegan who goes all teary eyed watching lions hunt gazelles on discovery channel. Instead of debating the issue from a moderate standpoint you got two inflammatory sides. What she says though is correct about obesity and pollution caused by farm factories but its not indicative of humans being omnivores. Cheap food created by the farm factories creates habits of overeating. The sheer profits creates a situation where pollution and disease in the farms are a byproduct. But the same can be said about vegetable farms that use fertilizer, clear land for farms, and spray their crops with poison.
When he said, which would you rather eat a squash or a rib eye (wtf is a texan rib eye?) I was hungry for both! And that's what it comes down to, lets have both, in moderation. Have them be local grown and produced and fresh from the farm or butchery. The prices are more but the pay off will be a healthier society.
OOH, I am so macho. That's why I eat meat (thumps chest)....Although, admittedly, the only thing I've ever hunted for was my dick – after a night of heavy boozing.
Please learn to spell before arguing a point.
Frankly, here at CNN we don't give a damn what you morons eat, as we've heard all these arguments a thousand times before. We are only interested in page views and ad revenue.
1) Factory like slaughterhouses are wrong ... period, no one can argue that. There are humane farming methods were the animals are much happier/healthier than they would have been in the wild. Maybe the first step is to crack down on these monstrous meat factories.
2) Do you really equate yourself with the rest of the animal kingdom? Can't you see humans are so much more, someday we will possibly be beyond wanting meat in our diet, but until then get off your high horse and stop pretending that animals are our equals. Humans have always been natural omnivores, it's part of who we are. Like it or not carnivors and ominvors are essential for a healthy ecosystem.
3) Not eating meat is probably an honorable thing to do, but not everyone is as perfect as you pretend to be. Attacking people for eating meat is not going to get through to them either.
Is this chick for real? How is she better then us? Does she see the factory farms? How the little spinach plants are ripped from their home and torn apart to make her salad? How can she excuse the murder of innocent carrots? The wholesale slaughter of potatoes? This lady is the epitome of hypocrisy.
The problem with this entire article is that Tim is arguing simply for the taste (not very good arguments I might add, as I don't think anyone would argue that meat tastes bad, nor is that the primary reason people are vegetarians), and Jane is arguing for moral reasons.
I don't know if this is the right way to go about educating people about animal cruelty. One look at this and people label it as PETA garbage and extremist. I don't eat meat from factory farms, but I am not morally against eating meat. It is natural for animals to eat other animals, and some animals would overcrowd us if we didn't hunt them (ie, deer in Michigan), and we would be hitting them with our cars like crazy. Perhaps many vegetarians would disagree with this argument, but I digress. Omnivores and herbivores attack eachother, and usually it is the meat-eaters attacking the vegetarians via teasing or disrespect, and meat-eaters only receive nagging at worst. I also don't think the argument that just because an animal is less intelligent than us we have the right to do as we please with it. That argument doesn't fly with other people or even some animals, so find another.
And really, people don't want to hear about vegetarian issues or look into factory farms because they like being ignorant. Don't you think there's a reason you're avoiding it? Probably because it's gross. I'm not a vegetarian (of sorts) because I hate meat and love vegetables – it's because the main way we procure meat is disgusting and cruel. Change that and I'll be all about that juicy steak.
In many asian countrys they eat dog and cat.I find it disgusting, but they don,t To each his own.
Aunt Voula: "What do you mean, he don't eat no meat?!?"
(pause)
"It's okay, I make lamb."
-from "My Big Fat Greek Wedding" ;-)
Wow, maybe a nice big steak would calm her down. Deep breaths Jane, deep breaths
A lot of her arguments seem based on factory farming. Would another solution not to just know where you're buying from? Go to an organic, local, free-range farm? I do agree meat consumption could be significantly lessened though. It's something I'm trying to do – those old habits are hard to break.
Other countries love meat!!! And cruel meat at that!!! HELLO...Foie Gras...mmm...delicious.
I personally have to respect both sides and arguments for they were very valid and well put together. but overall i still think meat is essential to living healthy. yes i said it. Sometimes as a vegetarian, finding a good source of protein in vegetables is hard and is mostly found in things such like beans and nuts. But taking in meat for your daily consumption should not be scrutinized. sure if you consume too much meat you can become fat through overindulging but taking in meat with a daily dose of vegetables can be just, if not more healthy than eating vegetables alone. also one more thing I would like to put into light is buying just vegetable is A LOT more expensive than buying a combo of both. Trust me I tried the whole vegetarian thing and it was considerably more expensive. Some people (like me) don't have that luxury to buy organic fruits and vegetables. If I offended someone or if you disagree its my bad, this is just my input from my experiences- Deuces.
First of all, to everyone who thinks "this broad" is dumb because she's eaten too many veggies, please compare her arguments to those of the chef and tell me which one sounds more intelligent.
Second, I eat meat but side with vegetarians to a certain extent. I limit my meat consumption to maybe one serving every other day. I like how it tastes and I can't see myself going without it. However, I do not eat factory-farmed meat. I am very aware of where my meat, eggs and dairy products come from and 90% of what I buy is "certified humane" and organic. I can eat this stuff knowing that the animals were treated well and most likely came from a small organic farm that is not responsible for the suffering and pollution that factory farms have created. There is a way to eat meat AND be relatively kind to animals AND to avoid contributing to global warming.
Finally, for anyone to say that one way is right and the other way is wrong is just ridiculous. Humans have the ability to reason and for some, their reasoning brings them to vegetarianism. For others it's to continue eating meat. The important thing is that they have at least thought about it and what kind of impact their decision will have on the earth and its inhabitants. When you eat an animal, respect the fact that an he or she gave its life for you and don't just treat it as some slab of bloody meat to which you are entitled as a carnivorous human.
I am impressed with this article. I agree with your arguments 100%. I was raised and trained by my parents in the JAIN religion, which is in minority all over the world. My religion believes in "Non-Violence" in microscopic nature. I have also found that vegetarian food is more tastier and healthier than any meat,fish, or chicken. You need to know how to prepare it. I am blessed by my mother and wife who are excellent cooks and never needed to go beyond vegetarian food for my appetite. After spending 35 years in India I have been living in US for last 17 years. My daughters went to University and lived in Dorms and are able to maintain Vegetarian tradition. Mr religion Jainism, is a strong believer and supporter of vegetarianism and goes little beyond that prohibiting from eating any food that is grown underground, like onion, potato, carrot etc. This is also for the same reason of causing violence and killing more insects in the harvesting.
If anyone needs help in staying or going to be vegetarian I am available for help.
Kirti Shah
Jain, you ignorant slu...
But seriously, I remember years ago reading, maybe in Ripley's, "believe it or not", that Jains wear masks over their faces to avoid even swallowing and killing insects. Is this true? Was it ever true?
I don't eat meat or plant life, as I'm solar powered.
You, my friend, are a super hero. Im not gonna lie, I wish I could be you.
Ummm........Anyone care to explain how vegetarians aim to feed the world without destroying the environment? If you think deforestation is a problem with grazing herds of feed animals just wait until you have to burn down all the rain forests to create enough farmland capable of producing the amount of fruits/vegetables capable of feeding the global population. Oh, and don't give me that organic nonsense. That won't be an option since production will have to keep up with demand. Hello pesticides and hello contaminated ground water. Guess this woman doesn't care about the conditions of all the "worker bees" that will have to slave away picking her spinach leaves. Hypocrisy..............
Being vegetarian is not the answer Jane seems to think it is. We need to be careful not to confuse the methods of agriculture currently used with eating meat and dairy. Factory farming is appalling and should be stopped; monocrop farming (corn, wheat, rice) has destroyed so much of our arable land, has driven out many native species of plants and animals, and is a huge cause of pollution. Increasing vegetarianism would likely increase monocrop agriculture.
As far as personal health, eating grains and refined sugar destroys our health, not eating well-cared for, grass-fed, pastured animals.
Hahaha... I think its hilarious that so many people would take offense to what this lady's saying. Take it easy everybody. Everyone's so hypersensitive that they didn't even consider the points she brought up. Her words mostly fell on deaf ears because Americans don't care about health.
Who cares that you can get more then enough protein from vegetables, fruits, nuts & beans? We'd rather get protein from sources that include more saturated fat and cholesterol because heart disease, colon cancer and obesity is the American way! Right guys? Why do other countries look at us as gluttonous, wasteful, arrogant, @$$holes? I dont know, I cant figure it out.
I have seen first hand the people starving in third world countries because their government's spending what money they do have on clearing land for livestock and feeding the livestock to sell the meat to America(the superconsumer of meat). Do most Americans care that people in other countries are starving to death so we can have Big Macs and Whoppers? Of course not. Why would we care about people other then ourselves? We dont. Screw everybody, including ourselves. We not only want to die of a heart attack or type 2 diabetes, we want the whole world to suffer because of it. Whoo hooo!!
People trying to tell me I shouldn't eat meat is akin to pro-life advocates trying to convince women that they shouldn't have abortions. It's my body, let me choose. Afterall, the animal I'm eating would have never been born if it weren't for the demand that I'm creating by wanting to eat it. Also, I will frequently see a live pig, think that they are very cute, and at the same time want to eat it.
There are way too many responses to read to see if anyone else made this point so I apologize in advance for being redundant. Has JVM and others stopped to think about what would happen if we all "chose" to stop eating meat? And not just cows, pigs, and chicken but turkeys, deer, duck, pheasant, etc. The planet would be OVERRUN with animals fending for themselves because, like it or not, while we do pen them for our consumption, we also feed and protect them from themselves. Yes there is a food chain and we are at the top of it. That's not arrogance, just fact. You want to talk inhumane, let them run rampant and see what happens. There would be mayhem on the streets and highways all over the world, cars unsuccessfully dodging cows every 5 seconds. Talk about roadkill!!!!! Imagine the billions of chickens we consume on a yearly basis running free. If we don't feed them, who will? And what about eating eggs? Milk from cows? That would cease to exist because of the excess famine and disease in the animal community. Let's be rational about this: choosing to be vegetarian may be a noble attribute but one that has irrational consequences.
Vegans are nutcases.
Humans are not herbivores, they are omnivores, that's why you have incisors. However I do believe the animals should be free roaming and treated humanly their entire life. There's nothing wrong or unhealthy about eating meat. All of my grandparents ate a lot of meat their whole life and they all died in their late 80's-90's. The key is balance. They also ate fruits and vegetables daily.
Alright, if you are vegan or vegetarian or whatever than that is great. You choose to be that way for whatever reason you may have and I completely, 100% respect that. I dated a boyfriend who was vegetarian and he introduced new foods I would have never thought to eat. Regardless if you are a meat-eater or not, you have to respect that it is a CHOICE. People can really choose to do whatever they want. The (sad) truth of the matter is, we will always eat meat. End of story. No matter how many people support animal rights, protest the slaughter houses, or try to preach people their beliefs, it will NEVER work. Yes, you may convince some people, but nothing will ever completely change.
Interesting that you respect the choice made by Vegans and such but the author above has absolutely zero respect for other's choice to eat meat. She fills her diatribe with vitriolic drivel intended to show how much better she is and how bad you are for doing something that makes HER feel guilty.
Ah, if only Vegans had respect for other's choices as other's do for theirs. But as long as her name calling, lies about poor parenting and party line "carcass" whining goes on then it is only us meat eaters that have respect for choices, while disapproving of the hatred spewed by the likes of this woman.
Frankly, if there was something worthy of respect about carnivorous diet, I would consider cannibalism as a pinnacle of its development.
I dare someone to mention ethics right now.
what a self righteous bitch. if vegetarians would ever shut up about it how much better they are, i wouldnt hate them. but they never do. 'rotting carcass' in front of you on the plate? please..... what a sensationalist.
I don't often post on news articles... I generally find it a waste of time. But this one, posted on the front page of cnn? Come on! This IS NOT NEWS first off. Secondly.... I just had to respond, enjoy my rant.
1.)
"It’s guilt-free eating, which is ultimately more pleasurable."
– How is eating meat, NOT guilt free? Now I had a friend who stopped eating meat because he decided he was not able to kill the animal himself. Fine. Personally? I love killing my own meat. That's a personal preference. So too is your response on the matter.
"America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis, one of the nation’s leading causes of preventable illness and death."
-No it's not, over-consumption of crap processed food, lack of exercise, and general laziness is the cause of the obesity crisis in this country. Not to mention deep-fried foods... you could have a COMPLETE vegetarian meal... deep fry that bad boy and see how "good" it is for you. There are too many variables when considering large scale obesity to ultimately say it's one thing or another... but as a very active athlete let me tell you... my consumption of meat has NOT made me obese. I'm quite in good shape, and I eat ALOT of meat. (Hell, I eat raw meat too)
"Children often naturally shun the taste of meat but are forced by their misguided, although well-meaning, parents into eating it anyway. Eventually, they develop a taste for it and it becomes their 'normal.'"
- IF you're going to make such a bold statement, please back it up with reliable research from known and respected sources. If you show me extensive studies have been done on this matter and it's the fact, fine. But I wonder, if it's true that children don't like meat, and it doesn't taste well.. why has every culture and people that have ever existed on EARTH eaten meat?
"America’s obsession with meat and dairy has pretty much destroyed our sense of taste. The average burger and milkshake meal is so overloaded with fat, salt and sugar that it has numbed our taste buds to virtually anything else. When you give up these addictive substances, then your taste buds have a chance to return to their natural state and you will begin to enjoy the subtle flavors of fruits and vegetables, which are lower in calories and have zero cholesterol."""
-This is not a fact. I LOVE vegetables with my meat.. I think it adds a very dynamic taste and flavor to the meal. Personally, I'm allergic to most fruits (but I doo love the taste.. mangos are very yummy, and it's worth getting sick off of from time to time) By the way, which average burger and shake are you talking about? The wood chip tasting crap sold at McD's? Maybe you just never ate good food? Burgers can be VERY tasty if you make them yourself.. if you get them at a fastfood joint... well you get what you paid for (a 1$ burger isn't designed to taste good.. it's designed to fill you)
2.)
-All of #2 I have a problem with. I think all living things are living. A plant, the vegetables and fruits you so push for everyone to eat. They’re all alive too. Just because you can’t relate to the way they feel and ‘think’ doesn’t mean they don’t. But they’re still tasty.. yum! IQ of a pig? How does that even work? Do you know what an IQ is exactly?? It’s a standardized test made for PEOPLE, and ranks you on a scale relative to everyone else. It’s also fairly inaccurate, etc. etc. So … please, if you’re going to make a statement like, “pigs have a high iq”, back that up with some research. Otherwise you sound like someone who has no idea what they’re talking about. So they’re as smart as a dog? Well some cultures eat dogs too. Not my thing personally, but whatever floats their boat.
3.)
“How can you talk about peace if your plate is swimming in blood?”
-Easily, the blood adds a nice taste to the meal. How can you eat vegetables and fruits knowing your killing their offspring? How can you eat a broccoli and cheddar soup, while you see those helpless broccoli floating in a boiling pool of cheddar?! Those bastards!
“America raises and kills about 10 billion animals for food every year. The overwhelming majority of those animals – cows, pigs, chickens, turkeys, lambs – are raised in hideous, overcrowded factory conditions. Ever wonder why we’re experiencing all those salmonella and swine flu outbreaks? A peak inside these factory farms would give you food for thought.”
-Easy, buy local. Buy organic. I buy as much as I can locally, thankfully I have a ton of small farms in the area. (This includes my vegetables…sadly the season is coming to a close, but there is nothing like getting carrots that still have dirt on them, washing them off.. damn things are delicious!)
“As for us vegetarians minding our own business, well, what people eat is everyone’s business. That’s because meat production is the single biggest cause of global warming – even beyond transportation. Rainforests are being leveled to create grazing land. Methane gas from the animals is rising up into the sky. Don’t take my word for it. The United Nations did a lengthy study and issued a report that’s easily accessed on the Internet.”
- Really? This is your counter argument for getting in my face for what I eat? There are literally dozens of things MUCH more harmful going into the air than cow farts. And the rainforests are getting leveled for farm land too you know.. Hey wait.. has that happened throughout history with the Aztecs, Mayans, etc? Yes, yes it has. They clear the forests with fire, and sometimes those go out of control and just consume crazy amounts of land. Is it wrong? Yes. Can you use that as an argument? No. The land is being used for your vege’s and fruits too, sorry.
“Also, factory farm run-off – yes I’m talking about all that animal waste – is creating a run-off pollution crisis that is threatening our rivers and oceans. Finally, there’s world hunger: the greatest health risk on the planet. There are almost a billion hungry people in this world. About one in seven humans do not get enough food. A lactating cow will consume every year almost six tons of forage dry matter, over 100 bushels of corn, 1,400 pounds of protein supplement, and 225 pounds of mineral/salt. You do the math. We could eliminate world hunger if, instead of concentrating all that food into meat, we fed it directly to starving people."
-We are NEVER going to eliminate world hunger. When genetically engineered foods and pesticides were created, that was their intent. Instead, what happened was a huge spike in populations around the world. As much as I agree that hunger is a problem that we should combat, even if there never is a victory in sight, the bottom line is that it will always exist, and at the moment our world is slightly overpopulated.
And the run off? There are much worse things that are being run off into our water system that I want addressed FIRST before cow poop.
4.)
-In today’s day and age, with access to pretty much all of the plants/veges available from around the world at your local store, than yes this argument holds true. But, you know what? You are causing so much damage to the environment by doing so! If you eat local foods as much as possible, a healthy mix of meats, and veges is a MUST. (it’s called moderation… and that’s what makes 2/3s of Americans obese, a lack of said moderation)
5.)
-Who cares? Honestly, if someone was roasting a pumpkin at a tailgate, I’d drunkenly stroll by wondering what the heck is going on? If he was at a tailgate party, chances are he’d throw me a beer, tell me what he was doing, and we’d have a grand ole time meeting someone new and interesting?
And tired traditions? You’re now assuming I’m bored with them. The traditions you speak of are a time to reconnect with the different generations in your family, and have something that y’all do together, or at least, to remember those that came before you, or the times you had in the past, etc.
You have way too much time on your hands and waste a lot of time replying to something you say is "NOT news". I didnt read your whole comment because it was immediately boring and unintelligent. Get a hobby, a job and/or a life.
Pee off Jay. Didn't bother reading all of your rant when I realized what an uninformed redneck you are, like many posting comments here.
Shame on you Jane Velez-Mitchell. You have no compassion for plants!
(just joking...)
I knew there was a reason I could not stand to watch that ignorant bitch.
She's ignorant? How so? Im not a fan of hers but, reading your comment, the ignorant one seems to be someone other than her. I'll let you try and figure that one out. Don't hurt yourself.
I knew there was a reason I could stand to watch that ignorant bitch.
NOT stand
Of course, the argument about all the hormone and antibiotics that are in meat should be enought to frighten people from eatting meat. On top of that, they inhumane way meat animals are raised it just plane disgusting!!
There is nothing worse than a preachy vegan. They take their argument to extremes. I hope none of them are dog owners, dogs are carnivores so does that make them wrong too? Hunting and the eating of meat has been done through out history. Show me unbiased studies that eating meat in moderation is unhealthy. And when you pluck a carrot, you kill it, it can't grow anymore, you murderer.
It sickens me to hear all the people on here who say they don't care about the arguments she presented against his weak "but I'll look bad and I'm told that it's normal to eat it" arguments. It's true that eating meat is the number one cause of health and environmental problems. It's a proven fact and you can't deny that. Plant sources of protein are much more complex and healthy for you as well. The food chain argument is a myth as well. Our jaws, teeth and digestive systems are build more similarly to plant eaters than meat eaters. Again, proven fact. If you own a pet, but eat factory farmed meat, then you are a hypocrite. PROVEN FACT that pigs equal the intelligence of a dog. But you'll care for one and eat the other? Makes sense to me! (duh!) I wish I could leave you in your own little meat eating world, if it did not affect every aspect of my life. I equate it to a smoker who doesn't give a crap that they are polluting the earth, killing themselves and everything around them, and contributing to the suffering of others. The problem with the folks who continue to eat meat is that they are ignorant and wish to remain that way. It sure is easier to do that than learn the facts and be forced to change. They must also have weak minds to buy into the propaganda from the government. Critical thinking people!!!!
oops – duplicate – sorry!
Wow, Jane Velez-Mitchell is like Benny Hin on veggies. What a solid dose of preaching. Get over yourself. I particularly enjoy the suggestion that horses eat grass, are muscular, and thus proof that humans should be vegetarians. Solid argument. I'm all for the ethical treatment of animals, but I can assure you all my meals are guilt free, despite the presence of a meat portion...though I swear I once heard a whimper from a radish.
It sickens me to hear all the people on here who say they don't care about the arguments she presented against his weak "but I'll look bad and I'm told that it's normal to eat it" arguments. It's true that eating meat is the number one cause of health and environmental problems. It's a proven fact and you can't deny that. Plant sources of protein are much more complex and healthy for you as well. The food chain argument is a myth as well. Our jaws, teeth and digestive systems are build more similarly to plant eaters than meat eaters. Again, proven fact. If you own a pet, but eat factory farmed meat, then you are a hypocrite. PROVEN FACT that pigs equal the intelligence of a dog. But you'll care for one and eat the other? Makes sense to me! (duh!) I wish I could leave you in your own little meat eating world, if it did not affect every aspect of my life. I equate it to a smoker who doesn't give a crap that they are polluting the earth, killing themselves and everything around them, and contributing to the suffering of others. The problem with the folks who continue to eat meat is that they are ignorant and wish to remain that way. It sure is easier to do that than learn the facts and be forced to change. They must also have weak minds to buy into the propoganda from the government. Critical thinking people!!!!
Anyone see the movie Scott Pilgrim vs The World? If vegans actually had super powers I'd stop eating meat but until that day I'll stick to my patented "Baryard Burgers"... angus burger, chicken breast, bacon and turkey topped with jalepeno havarti. Finish it all up with a nice cold beer.
i wouldn't say eating meat is necessarily a bad thing. For me the problem lies with the factory farms. It is almost a form of genocide. One thing that makes us human is our ability to have empathy. Just imagine what life inside a factory farm is, being pumped full of antibiotics and growth hormones and living in your own feces only to be slaughtered.. Eating local, small farm meats that are able to graze and have room to live a semi-normal life sounds better. I used to be against hunting, but hunting at least allows for a more humane life for the animal, rather than factory farms. She had some well-thought out points. 10 billion animals a year are killed to feed Americans! Wow! That is over twice the population of humans on the earth every year!
Anyone who says that the cause of obesity in the U.S. is because we eat too much meat, is ignoring the true causes– lack of exercise and fast food consumption. Yes, if you plan on doing no exercise whatsoever, then a diet full of veggies and grains is the way to go. However, if you exercise, i.e. lift weights, run, or do yoga, you can eat meat.
There is one powerful notion that validates the idea of eating meat for me. Walk into a gym. Go to the area where the heavy weights are being lifted. The area where energy is being burned, and muscle is being built. Ask everyone in that area what they have eaten today. They will all say meat and vegetables. Carbs? Maybe. But every single person will have eaten meat and vegetables. Had these people not eaten meat, chances are they would not be making it through their workouts. And if they do workout on a vegetarian diet, building of muscle after the workout becomes much harder. Yes, I'm sure some people pack on muscle by eating vegetarian and making it work. But there is a reason that would require as much effort as a full time job- nature has provided us an easy way of obtaining protein for building muscle– chicken!
Instead of crucifying the meat eater, why don't we all band together and crucify the real problem? Lazy people who do no exercise, and people who eat fast food constantly.
It sickens me to hear all the people on here who say they don't care about the arguments she presented against his weak "but I'll look bad and I'm told that it's normal to eat it" arguments. It's true that eating meat is the number one cause of health and environmental problems. It's a proven fact and you can't deny that. Plant sources of protein are much more complex and healthy for you as well. The food chain argument is a myth as well. Our jaws, teeth and digestive systems are build more similarly to plant eaters than meat eaters. Again, proven fact. There are so many more reasons to go vegan as well. If you own a pet, but eat factory farmed meat, then you are a hypocrite. PROVEN FACT that pigs equal the intelligence of a dog. But you'll care for one and eat the other. The problem with the folks who continue to eat meat is that they are ignorant and wish to remain that way. It sure is easier to do that than learn the facts and be forced to change. They must also have weak minds to buy into the propoganda from the government. Critical thinking people!!!!
My only problem here is... All the vegetarian did was dissect the things the meat dude had said... Which isn't really fair... Because it is obvious a lot of what he said was in jest.... And all the vegetarian bullshit stuff was stone cold serious. She doesn't really tell me how going vegetarian actually tastes better though... I really like pigs... They're cute, and smart, but they also taste delicious and if we didn't eat pigs they'd probably be about abundant as siberian tigers. I also love tofu and veggies and all that... But ribeye steaks and bacon are amazing... And in moderation THEY'RE OK.
I don't understand the hatred Vegans have towards animals. It is one thing to kill and eat an animal but to advocate the extinction of entire species? That is a hatred I can't fathom.
If all people followed vegan lifestyle numerous species would go extinct, they cannot live in the wild, the are not pets, without economic incentive people would stop breeding them.
Where does this vegan hatred of animals come from?
Save a cow. Eat a vegan.
BRILLIANT!
IN YOUR FACE MEATHEADS!!!!
wooooooooohoooooooooooo
Most people are fat and overweight because they eat garbage meat, such as McDonald's and BK. If more people ate Fresh Veggies and Grass Fed beef, or organically grown meat, the change would be astonishing.
Recommended Read - The Paleo Solution by Robb Wolf - AMAZING
meat can be ordered from a local farm, if you are willing to pay 7-10 bucks a lbs. i think if people start eating a balanced diet things would be better for the animals, meaning less animals killed. it is true that humans eat way to much meat and if you hang around a farm long enough you will start to see that animals have personalities and are fun to be around. looking at it both ways, land still needs to be destroyed to make way for both sides. so even if one says they are vegan blood is still on their hands.
There's a lot of us vegetarians and vegans that do it for reasons beyond the animal rights. For me it was because I wanted to lose weight and meat and dairy slow your metabolism down so I cut it out as a part of a calorie counting program and the weight came off a lot faster then my meat and dairy eating calorie counting friends!
Look, the biggest beef I have with PETA and other Vegans is their forcing their choices onto us. I get it, you don't like meat, now shut-up and go about your life style and leave me in peace while I go on living mine. YOU might think that meat is murder, but I do not. Not every farm is abusing it's animals, not every slaughterhouse abuses what it processes. We aren't fat because we eat meat, we are fat because we eat too much food. Last time I checked, chocolate cake wasn't a meat product.
Remionder: This article was in response to a chef making light of vegetarians.
Its sad that all these vegans can't see that they are species bigots! All living things eat other living things to survive. Killing plants ends their forward genetic contribution, just like killing an animal, so other than blood flowing, what is the difference?
This is America. Everyone is entitled - within the law - to their "cup of tea". And everyone is entitled - within the law- to defend their "cup of tea". In the long run more people will be happy when we all choose to celebrate our differences and support each other's choices.
Note: I do not fall into any particular extreme category - "tree hugger", "gun nut", etc. I just want the greatest number of people to be happy. And for health reasons I am beginning to gravitate towards being a vegetarian.
Vegetarians or not eat what you please. It is the food chain. go take a walk in the jungle and tell the lion to go vegetarian. I am not saying stuff your faces with meat that is unhealthy, but eating the right amount is more healthy then not eating it at all. And Yes plants are alive to. It is the food chain, nature, survival of the fittest
All of you horrible vegans are killing all of those defenseless plants! You should be ashamed of yourselves! Those poor carrots didn't want to be cooked or eaten, they don't deserve to be slaughtered the way they are. That squash is alive as well, but I guess you just don't care about them. All you care about is getting your food without thinking about other living beings that you are murdering!
The argument "the conditions under which meat is processed are morally unacceptable (factory farms), therefore we should not eat meat" is akin to the argument "the conditions under which my clothes are made are morally unacceptable (sweat shops), therefore we should not wear clothes.
Her responses are meaningless. You can buy animal products from a local coop who purchase their meats from reputable farmers who raise the animals humanely. As for "feeling sad" when she smells bacon, that has to be the lamest comment I've read in a long time. We are not conditioned to eat meat, we have been doing it since humans have existed. As for her salmonella comment, there have been many news stories about E. Coli from tainted sprouts, raw vegetables, and other "guilt free" foods. Stupid b!tch.
Were those last two words really necessary? Did they add anything to your argument? No, they invalidated your entire comment.
This is what drives me nuts about Vegans! Factory farms are abhorrent and should be outlawed but I hate it when people get on their preacher pulpit and start harping on something they know nothing about! I doubt she has spent much time outside of New York much less ever seen a free range chicken farm in Kansas or cattle ranch in Montana!
If she can explain to me how 100 bushels of corn, 1400 pounds of supplement and 225 of salt add up to 6 tons I will never eat a piece of meat again!
100*56+1400+225=7225/2000=3.6tons.
"I actually get quite sad when I smell bacon."
If I were a vegetarian and smelled bacon knowing I couldn't have any, I'd be sad too. I went on a diet once where I didn't allow myself to eat bacon and it made me very sad.
And I am definitely not insensitive to the harsh reality of factory farming. Luckily, there are other options, although until I am more financially comfortable, I’m not going to shop at Whole Foods or a local butcher. And in the meantime, I’m definitely not going to give up meat. Stop making us carnivores sound like savages and comparing a delicious juicy hamburger or some yummy fried chicken to “an animal’s rotting carcass,” because it’s not the same thing at all. Except for our meat-raising practices, we as humans are no different than any other carnivorous animals and have a natural right to eat whatever we want.
I agree she probably should have left the "rotting" part out! Ha! Ha! But again, giving up meat takes a certain level of commitment.
bitnar, you are absolutely right. Even though some (or many) may agree that the animals' conditions are horrible, the fact is that not everyone can do it. And that's where the debate should end.
Is her wristwatch strap in that photo made of leather?
This story is biased because its framed in an argument against eating meat, not an even debate.
I love being a vegetarian b/c i know that i won't ever feel bad about what i put in my body. I love animals and people should realize that factory farms are absolutely DISGUSTING in every way imaginable...it breaks my heart to envision a world even WORSE than the one we've created in order to fuel this industry. I'm not one to tell pe...ople to quit eating meat altogether..but imagine if there were no nasty, filthy and overcrowded slaughter houses, but instead fresh farms that allow their animals to graze the fields and have fresh air all the time.. this would certainly make animal products available for distribution go down...but imagine how much better you would feel about eating meat and how much healthier our societies would become? Just a thought.. ;)
"Custom will reconcile people to any atrocity". Peace.
I have no problem with people being vegetarian. I have many friends who are vegetarian and I always accommodate them when having them over for dinner, and we mutually respect each others decisions. What I don't like is people on either side who say they are right or wrong and preach that they are more moral or a better person than the other, similar to this author and many of the fellow posters. This is no different than someone who is religious saying that because they believe in a specific religion that they are better or more moral than others. Please can't we just all get along and respect each others decisions?
A vegan. No meat no fish no milk no eggs no cheese etc. Try eating gravel instead. I can't eat vegetables because every time I bite into them I can I hear them scream in pain.
I can see why you would think that. Most restaurants (and school cafeterias) do a terrible job of preparing vegetables or vegetable-based meals. However, if it's done right, you truly don't miss the meat. I still don't care for Brussels sprouts, but I've discovered so many foods that I hadn't tried before that are terrific. It is not easy unless you do your own cooking most of the time. Becoming a vegan or vegetarian takes commitment. Not everyone has the fortitude to do it. I was 45 years old before I made the switch. It took that long for me to open my eyes and see the truth.
"America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis, one of the nation’s leading causes of preventable illness and death."
Really? I thought it was over consumption of carbs, which makes people tired and lethargic, followed by lack of exercise because they are tired all the time.
I've tried this both ways, and the only way to eat right is to have a balanced meal. About 40% protein, 40% carbs, and 20% fat along with a daily exercise routine of hard exercise for about 1/2 an hour. Ultimately the old equation of calories in > calories out = weight gain, and calories in < calories out = weight loss is still true.
Now if you want to try to get your 40% protein from vegetables I don't have a problem with that, but don't tell me I am somehow wrong because I get a large portion of it eating lean, healthy meats and fish.
okay, meow.
there are huge benefits to eating less meat, it is a well known facyt that america eats too much meat, et cetra, but there are advantages to meat as well. the approach for vegeterianism is terrible too, i bet shes a memebr of PETA. guilt tripping anyone into a descision about anything is not a positive reinforcement. the fact of the matter is if somebody read this and decided to go vegeterian because of it, it owuld probably last about 2 weeks. want to increase your following? quit talkinbg about crying over slaughtered pigs! I was a strict vegan for two years, and while my digestive tract was better regulated, and i trimmed down a little, i also couldnt get tan, i felt frail, and no amount of screwey suppliments could fix it.
vegetarianism is a choice, as is omnivorism. it is my opinion that an expanded variety of fruits, vegetables, and legumes that comes with being a vegetarian is incredibly beneficial, and delicious, but eating meat is part of out genetic makeup as well.
I agree vegans do have a holier-than- thou complex. If we did not eat other animals than their food supplies would dry out and they would strave. Which one is better? A relative of my friend was a vegan and she was told that she had cancer. The doctor told her to eat more protien (red meat). She refused and then she passed away. You can have your vegan life style, just let me have a steak.
Epic Fail! Try again.
Jane Valez-Mitchell's arguments are brilliant. Thank you.
The meat eater's arguments are just plain stupid.
That pretty much summarizes Jane Valez-Mitchell's "article"...
(I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that it was your intention to summarize, not comment.)
this lady cant be serious
She is serious. Serious as your eventual heart attack ;-)
Eat what you want to and get out of the other guy's face. Geesh. I happen to be a vegetarian for no politically-correct reason. If invited out to a friend's house, I'll have some of their meat without feeling guilty about it. We literally stuff ourselves and are satisfied. These debates are not news.
I view vegetarians like I view anyone of any religion. I respect your beliefs as long as you aren't forcing them on me. Nothing makes me madder than someone trying to quilt trip me into not finishing a meal because there's meat in it.
Really. I can think of a lot of things that should make you madder than that. I'll tell you what, when your diet stops including having someone else murder animals for you as well as wrecking our planet and costing me more money for your health care then I'll get off your back about meat.
Personally, I became a vegetarian around 12 or 13 for the simple, non-political reason that the idea of eating a dead body was disgusting to me. The older I got, the more good reasons I found for my decision (such as the fact that it is incredibly better for the environment). The argument that we were as humans physically "designed"/"built" to kill/eat meat doesn't work on me either. At one point it may have been essential, but other animal species have evolved, right...?(Apologies to the McDonnell types who don't believe in evolution.) Then I've known or even seen on TV famously "vegetarian food doesn't taste as good" chefs admit that they've had vegetarian meals–usually in other countries–that DID taste as good. But that might take some extra effort, and Mickey D's is just all-around easier, right? I do know that bullying people about it won't work, but I've never met a person yet who didn't feel better on a vegetarian diet. It's certainly worth trying–probably best to ease into it.
We have incisors for a reason...TO EAT MEAT. I think this chick has drank too much of the Vegan Kool Aid to be taken seriously. it has been scientifically proven that humans need a balance diet with meat and vegetables. I am a proud meat eater and I love the way animals taste PERIOD!
You wacko, militant, holier than thou, I'm better than u, nose in the air bitch. This is what I expect from vegans–"look at me, my tampon is made from soy, I am saving the planet" gimme a break. Go live in the woods, eat swamp roots (if you can find any) and wither away.
At least she uses a Vinegar Dueshe in keeping with her Vegan theme. I should Know!
For vegetarians wondering about the animosity from omnivores, have you ever looked at yourselves? Personally I couldn't care what your preferences are...until they inevitably start spouting idealistic self-righteous BS like the guy in this article, worst is when they start shoving it down other people's throats.
For vegetarians doing it for the health benefits – I have nothing but respect and admiration.
For vegetarians doing it for purely idealistic reasons – you are the dumbest human beings alive if you think your dietary choice will affect how the world runs.
You are feel "guilty" when you smell bacon? Get over yourself – believe it or not, the world doesn't revolve around you.
*girl in the article. Typo. But has many have pointed out...this is that exact holier-than-thou attitude I can't stand. Eating vegetables does not, in fact, make you better than everyone else.
I eat steak maybe 1-2 times a month but I will eat a nice juicy ribeye tonight just because I read this article.
Tonight I will order a steak, and have a cow killed in Ms Jane Velez-Mitchell's honor.
idiots, idiots everywhere
Also, for those of you who make the argument that humans were "originally" not meat eaters (and that, in itself is HIGHLY debatable), looking back down the evolutionary chain is a terrible argument. You might as well say "okay everybody, stop using your thumbs – it's unnatural to use thumbs, we only evolved them as we got smarter and started to use tools."
There is one reason and one reason only to eat vegetarian – choice. (No, not health. You can eat health with meat, and you can live unhealthy without it.)
Seriously ... I can't believe people feel the need to try and guilt us into eating Veggies only ... It's kind of sad ...
We live in a world where we are free to make out own choices.. and I personally like to eat meat .. I'm sorry .. but personally .. at the end of the day .. I'm not going to be sitting around thinking .. Man i could shure go for some steamed asparagus right now. Not that it doesn't go well with a juicy steak mind you.
Yes you can look at the negative impacts of farm raising whatever whereever ... but those facts don't negate the fact that people want to eat meat.
My only real question is .. why can't we live in a world where people make thier own dietary descisions without people being Jack@sses about it?
f'in hippies
All food is killing... unless you can find a way to live on water and minerals alone.
Some people just need a reason to feel good about themselves.
Come on, this is so extreme. The guy obviously loves his meat and has some valid points, and so does Jane. However I can't help but feel that Jane's responses are more like bitter, over-exaggerated attacks. Some people are into meat, some are not, for a whole list of reasons. The part where she says "If huge amounts of protein were the key to perfect health, America would be the healthiest nation on earth because we eat a lot more meat than people in most other countries." The guy said "in moderation." Not "huge amounts." And wake up – many other countries' diets consist of meat, sometimes more so than our culture. It's how you prepare it (grilled vs fried like in the middle east), what you add to it, and HOW MUCH of it you eat. Of course if you're opposed to the slaughtering of animals in general, this whole discussion is moot. Obviously what you believe would take precedence over what you prefer. And speaking of other countries, there are some poor countries that have animals running around and very few fruits and veg – tell them to be vegeterian why don't you.
I have one son who is very into meat despite the fact that our household eats mostly (not completely) veg, and another son who just never prefered the taste. That's preference vs the culture in which you were raised.
Call me selfish or uncaring but I could give a crap less about factory farms or PETA vegan freaks. Bottom line is vegan and vegitarian food takes like well grass. I don't mind a side of brocolli or a potato, but I love a good steak and no rabbit food can compare to it. Is that woman serious? Squash? lol dumbest thing I ever heard!
I love it how she states that once she stopped eating meat her taste buds changed, and that most children don't like the taste of meat, but then goes to say she eats Tofurkey, which is made to taste like meat!
Way to contradict yourself JVM.
OK, I eat meat and I like the taste. I have no problem with people choosing to be vegetarian. It is a fundamental right for people in America.
What is really annoying is someone like Jane Velez-Mitchell or other vegetarians that decide they have to limit my freedom of choice. The same is true the other way around, I don't go around and try to argue with you about eating meat so please respect my choice and my freedom. As the comments show clearly there are arguments to be made on both sides. However, stop laying on the guilt trip!
Guilt trip you ask, I can make the reverse argument and there are some links posted. Frankly some of the information is questionable. However, the extreme end of the vegetarian argument is the God complex. As argued green house gases are a result of animals and farming. So are we saying by killing off the animals we make a better world? Or like one extreme voice said house pets are even worth they have no purpose. No I don't want to eat my dog or cat, but as such they are living beings and good companions.
So when I look at both extreme arguments it sounds like a gay guy trying to convince me that out of moral obligation and based on his choice I have to turn gay too. That is the problem I grant everybody the freedom of their on choice as long as it does NOT entrench on my freedom.
...and yes you have the right to speak your mind, but please stop being an evangelist preaching a religion that I don't want to hear.
I did not claw my way to the top of the food chain to eat salad.
For many years my husband and I had meat for meals. About a year ago, we both became vegetarian after watching a video about factory farms. It was not that hard of a transition because there are so many products that supply protein. Within weeks, we were both feeling much better, more energy. Cholesterol went down a huge number of points and many of the small ailments that we had for years vanished. All in all, it made us both far more healthy. The idea of eating meat now sickens me. A close friend ate meat after being vegetarian for a long while and he got violently sick with nausea. You can talk about the food chain all you want but if you want to be healthy, remove meat from your meals. Your heart will thank you. No, neither of us is anemic, and no neither of us is suffering from malnutrition. We are in far better shape than before. We also live knowing that nothing has had to suffer or die for us to have a meal. The arguement that animals are born to die is stupid. Life is precious to anything living. Anything that has a brain and nervous system feels pain and suffers. Pull your head out of your butt and realize that these are living beings that want to live just as much as you do. They are not inanimate objects. If you have no compassion then you are sad indeed. If life of another being is so unvaluable to you, then you are a pathetic person. It all comes down to if you want to be healthy, elminate meat. If you want to wallow in cholesterol and have your heart explode, then chow down. Maybe you can get a knife and fork and just take a cow down on the run.
I will always eat meat or vegtables at my own discretion...I don't need a devot lesbian or anyone else telling me what I can or can't eat! I hunt...I shoot my own game...I kill it and grill it as Ted Nugent would say...don't like it...that is your problem...oh by the way...I do like fruits and vegtables also...I just don't like fruits like this moron telling me what is good and what isn't.
That's three reasons – the first three listed are obviously all the same reason: guilt. And number five is the same as saying you should wear a paper dress as a refreshing change of pace. So, really the reasons listed here are 1) guilt, 2) guilt, 3) guilt, 4) health (debatable), and 5) change of scenery. Is that all you've got?
But you forgot the most "important" reason for being vegetarian – so you can look down on everyone else, Ms. Velez-Mitchell.
There are actually good reasons for being a veggie, but this lady is a little hung up on herself.
Hominid evolution led to our ancestors eating meat which led to our large brains which led to the internet which leads to me posting this link:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128849908
I eat steak without feeling like im eating a rotting carcass....I smell bacon without becoming sad. They are some of my favorite food!!!!!
And to blame obesity on the fact that we eat meat and dairy is absurd and ignorant. People are obese because they have no self control, as well as how easily available food is compared to the olden days.
As for the animals it is understandable to feel some sort of remorse. But, still we are mammals and the food chain still exist. The only reason more and more people are able to feel sorry for eating animals is because other foods are so readily available. If you were starving in a cold winter house and all you had was a warm slab of deer meat. I guarantee you the feelings of that deer would be the last thing in your mind. We are in a society where we no longer have to feed on animals...but that does not make it wrong. That does not mean eating animals will make you obese. Do not be so close minded to believe that we are not animals ourselves. Be a vegan because you in this food rich nation you have the ability to be. Do not judge others for being human.
Yesterday I ate a steak the size of Texas and I felt totally at peace doing it
The reason people are so stuck on meat is because they are not educated. If half of these people educated themselves and went to a slaughter house they would never eat meat again. They can't care about their health as well. It is a know fact that the reason there is so much colon cancer these days is due to the fact that the meat they are eating is laying in the body and rotting. How gross..
Some of points do not make sense. For instance, she refers to all the animal waste that is being produced but wouldn't there be much more waste if the animals lived longer? Also, E Coli is often found in produce and its actually harder to kill (tomatoes, lettuce, etc) because we do not cook the bateria out of these types of food. However, we do cook bateria out while cooking meat. I read the article thinking maybe she could make me consider her lifestyle but her argument is not very strong and it is very vague.
WOW-
Lots of comments and lots of issues in a simple five item list.
1. If you want to be a vegetarian fine. I don't care what you eat; you shouldn't care what I eat – Let's respect each other. Actually, my secretary is a vegetarian and we occassionally tease each other about lunches and its all in good fun. This follows the holiday traditions- you have yours, whatever religiion, and I have mine.
2. Animal rights. Yes, commerical farming operations can be cruel and should be regulated. However, don't impose your eating chocies on the small "organic" farms are as a full explaination to ethics.
3. Land use. Whether for crops or animals, I have found people like to look at the "wide open space" from their front porch but can't understand it when the farmer can no longer pay the taxes and sells it off to a development. A little more appreciation for the American Farmer – crop or meat – would be appreciated.
4. Healthiness of the diet – vegan, ominvore or carnivore diets can be healthy or unhelath depending on what is used. The key process to a diet is to burn as much or more calories than you consume. How you do that is up to you. Additionally, the added preservatives from the fast food industry adds additional calories. The lack of time for balanced diet, the inexpensivenss of fast food, and lack of exercise have more to do with the America's obesity problem than what type of diet.
5. Animal uses. If all the complaining fringe end vegans could please remove their leather shoes, coats and belts, take off makeup (even if not tested on animals, animal fats are used to make it), stop using paint, glue, gelatin, etc before complaining about misuse of animals. Research all the items animal products are used in manufacturing before you start a holier than thou speech. You would be surprised.
my ancestors didn't climb to the top of the food chain so i could eat carrots.
I have never seen such stupidity in my entire life, "Oh my god the poor fucking dolphins" fuck them, adapt or die. If any of you can realistically say that eating a fucking soy burger is as good as an all beef one then I'll change, until then Fuck 'em. Meat = WIN
What do people expect to happen to animals that humans raise for food if we all stopped eating them? Ｗｈｏ ｔａｋｅｓ ｃａｒｅ ｏｆ ｔｈｅｍ ａｎｄ ｗｈｙ？Those animals are not capable of sustaining themselves without humans looking after them. So if we are not eating them, why bother taking care of them? Ｔｈｅｙ ｗｉｌｌ ｌｉｋｅｌｙ ｄｉｅ ｏｆｆ ｂｅｃａｕｓｅ ｔｈｅｉｒ ｉｎｓｔｉｎｃｔｓ ｆｏｒ ｎａｔｕｒａｌ ｓｕｒｖｉｖａｌ ｈａｓ ｌｏｎｇ ｂｅｅｎ ｂｒｅｄ ｏｕｔ ｏｆ ｔｈｅｍ． Ｂｕｔ Ｉ ｓｕｐｐｏｓｅ ｔｈｅ ｅｘｔｉｎｃｔｉｏｎ ｏｆ ｅｎｔｉｒｅ ｓｐｅｃｉｅｓ ｏｆ ａｎｉｍａｌｓ ｉｓ ｐｒｅｆｅｒａｂｌｅ ｔｏ ｌｅｔｔｉｎｇ ｔｈｅｍ ｐｒｏｐａｇａｔｅ ｗｈｉｌｅ ｗｅ ｅａｔ ｔｈｅｍ．
Ｗｈａｔ ａｂｏｕｔ ａｎｉｍａｌｓ ｔｈａｔ ａｒｅ ｓｔｉｌｌ ｈｕｎｔｅｄ． Ｔｈｅｉｒ ｎａｔｕｒａｌ ｐｒｅｄａｔｏｒｓ ｗｅｒｅ ｒｕｎ ｏｆｆ ｏｒ ｋｉｌｌｅｄ ｏｆｆ． Ｔｈｅｙ ｗｉｌｌ ｂｒｅｅｄ ｔｏ ｅｘｃｅｓｓ ａｎｄ ｓｔａｒｖｅ ｔｏ ｄｅａｔｈ （ｏｎｅ ｏｆ ｔｈｅ ｗｏｒｓｔ ｗａｙｓ ｔｏ ｄｉｅ） ｗｉｔｈｏｕｔ ｈｕｍａｎ ｉｎｔｅｒｖｅｎｔｉｏｎ ｉｎ ｔｈｉｎｎｉｎｇ ｔｈｅｉｒ ｎｕｍｂｅｒｓ。
Matrix, nature has a funny way of curing itself. So I don't think your argument holds thru. We made the mess we are in ourselves, we are the takers out of a pretty darn good book ISHMAEL.
Don't get me wrong I am all about choice and my choice is meat. However, the logical consequence of your argument is that we screwed it up and therefore have to continue to do so leads to the conclusion that we might be the species that needs to be eliminated to restore order and natural balance.
As I said in another post, some times the two extreme sides of this argument are like a gay guy asking me for tolerance, but at the same time preaching to me that his way is the only way and for moral reasons I have to become gay. It feels like to evangelists preaching each other religion to each other instead of arguing for choice and freedom.
This is pretty simple if I want to eat a 16oz Ribeye tonight and my vegetarian friend does not, I will not continue to cut pieces of my steak and put it on his plate. That would be disrespectful to him/her and would put me in a situation where I make the argument I know better. The only thing I ask for is that they don't start putting their grilled soya patty on my plate to convince me this has to be my taste as this would be as disrespectful to my freedom of choice.
Im a 16 year old who lives in athens ohio, its mainly a rural community. For all you people who are against eating meat let me tell you something. We've had several droughts around here at many times throughout the years and vegetables were scarce. You know how people survived? They hunted the natural game and slaughtered animals to survive. So if your saying were not supposed to eat meat then your pretty much saying that alot of people in my area should have died instead of eating meat. Also hunting and slaughtering our local meat has supported people for a long time. my school even gies us the first day of deer season off, so we can go kill us a tasty little deer!
OM NOM NOM NOM NOM
Too many responses to read them all but someone said it was not natural for humans to be vegan. Acutally it is the other way around. Our early hominods were all vegan, living off the land. Our appendix originally contained the enzymes needed to digest cellulose, a major constituent of plants. However, at some point we (humans) began to eat meat, first raw then cooked. As we evolved into meat eaters, our appendix began to shrink and become unproductive. Either lifestyle can be healthy if done in moderation and with smart decisions. Either can be unhealthy if done in excess and with uninformed decisions. The rest is all about blue and red upbringing just like gun issues, abortion issues. All driven by the diversity in our society.
I respect everyone's choice whether for health or belief reasons. That said there is evidence showing the vegetarian/ vegan lifestyle is not as healthy for your body as everyone believes.
here is one example: http://hunter-gatherer.com/blog/testimonial-how-colbert-report-saved-my-life
Humans have eyes in front of our heads, like eagles, wolves, and lions.... we are predators. Enough said.
vegetables have rights too! Plants feel pain just like animals! is grass not made of blades? do stars not shoot? Nature be well armed and demands so of her servants!
Seriously... you freaking hypocritical, self-righteous "animal rights activists" do nothing more than stroke yourselves in your own withless worthless slanted point of views which place you above the rest whom you deem lower since they eat meat.
and this quote from the story, "I would much rather devour a piece of well-seasoned squash than a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass. It’s guilt-free eating, which is ultimately more pleasurable. America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis..." - Just goes to show your ignorance as well as your hypocracy. The squash is dead... therefore a ROTTING CARCASS. Also, meat doesn't cause obesity... so much ignorance... so little brain...
What's the main cause of Colon Cancer, MEAT, stuck in your body rotting, find out how long it takes your body to digest meat, find out how long it takes to digest an apple. and while you are at it, do some research on the leading causes of heart attacks, high blood pressure, obese, the list goes on and on, try leaving a uncooked steak in your fridge for a week, than eat it.
I wouldn't dare leave an uncooked steak in my fridge for a week. Everyone knows that the best steak is dry aged! No fridge necessary for that.
Ok, I have been a vegetarian since birth. Whenever I tell someone I dont eat meat they get a little nervous – like I am going to try to convert them or lecture them on why they shouldn't eat meat. I am more of the opinon that everyone should do what is best for them. Reading this article though I think that this woman comes off a bit preachy. She does make some good points like how badly animals are treated/killed and that Americans should eat more vegetables.
Lots of comments here that nobody reads.
So, if you don't feel "guilt" for eating meat and don't create artificial negative labels like "rotting carcass" eating meat is better.
Cows, mmmm, delicious
It's quite sad that JVM's usual TV persona is so vapid by comparison.
Thank you Jane for standing up and saying what is on many, many people's minds. If we all start making enough noise maybe the factory farms can get shut down ~ haha, I'm dreaming. But maybe if more people would buy local, free-range, or natural meats a difference in those poor animals lives would be made. Also, if restaurants would start making a stand and buying only free range meat and dairy, that also would help destroy factory farming.
"Instead of killing a turkey on Thanksgiving, why not go to a farm animal sanctuary and feed some turkeys?" WTF??? How much more disconnected from reality can you be, lady? Keep living in your shiny little fantasy world.
How about I go to a "farm animal sanctuary" feed a turkey it's last meal then kill it and have it feed my loved ones while celebrating our country's beautiful history of Thanksgiving? The turkey will be a part of an uplifiting and traditional event instead of it dying an uneventful death and being consumed by maggots.
BTW, I'm not insensitive to animal rights. I disagree wholeheartedly with whaling and I don't hunt anymore. I even agree that we consume more meat than we should and that we all should eat more fruits and vegetables. I'm all for free range animals as well as organics. I think farmers/ranchers need a government incentive (since they're getting them anyway) to be more organic. I really wish that fast food restaraunts had better choices for those who try to eat healthier as well, with foods that are healthy AND filling.
This is ridiculous. Anything in moderation is fine. People really do need to stop this "holier than thou" nonsense. Just because something works for one does not mean that it works for everyone. Just live and let live. If meat eaters don't like to be around vegetarians, then don't go to a vegetarian restaurant. On that same note, vegetarians need to back off meat eaters. Don't go to a steakhouse or a neighbors BBQ if all you're going to do is complain and preach.
If I choose to eat a T-bone, so be it. If I decide to eat tofu....again, so be it.
I'm sure each and every one of us do things that other people will disagree with every single day. I live my life for me. I don't lie, cheat, steal, etc etc. I live as right as I possibly can. BUT....no matter what I do, there will always be someone unhappy with something I'm doing or not doing.
I guess what I'm saying is just back off! Let people live their own lives... No matter what, everyone is contributing to global warming in some fashion. Everyone is contributing to deforestation in some way. Basically, everyone is contributing to all sorts of national and global problems in some way or another. Remember, people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones! ;-)
A healthy meal consists of meat/poultry/fish, vegetables, dairy, and fruits. Both are wrong. However, had nature interned for man to only eat meat or vegetables then the body would have been designed to eat only those things. STOP FIGHTING NATURE!!!
Good for you for not eating meat. Good for you for thinking your healthier than meat eaters.
If someone preaches to me about how savage I am for hunting a deer, field dressing it, butchering it myself, and using it as to not waste any usable part of it, I may show them exactly how savage I have the ability to be. Sound violent? Perhaps but as everyone has pointed out, we are all animals. I also have will power and restraint. I choose to eat meat.
Please stay out of my business, veggie killer. That goes for just about everyone else too.
As Denis Leary once said: to not eat meat is a choice. To eat meat is an instinct.
typical liberal/femenist/hippie/tree-hugger/prius-driving/save the whales/etc ideology; this woman is word-vomiting on all of you. Many of her facts are complete bologna (i'd like to throw some at her and watch her have a melt-down).
Sorry, none of my children and grandchildren ever shunned meat. They took to meat like you take to squash. Also, sorry again but look at your teeth, do they look like a cow’s teeth? No, nature has bred us humans to eat both meat and vegetables. And please don’t use the fast food argument, which I agree fast food is bad, because most fast food vegetarian Chinese food is just as overloaded with salt, sugar, and fat. It’s not the food per se it’s the preparation.
As far as the inhumane raising of food animals, I totally agree with abhorring the methods used by many companies. But, that again should not be a condemnation of eating meat but a battle to be fought in government regulation and our voting with our dollars. I buy from free range pasture fed and finished, where the animals are humanely treated.
And by the way, when looking at the horse, do not forget to look at the horses digestive tract. Sorry, but it does not look or function like your digestive tract. It is designed for grass and hay, yours is not
And forget the environmental argument, as much or more run off pollution comes from the pesticides and chemical fertilizers of vegetable farming.
If you honestly do not like the taste of a well prepared steak, I am ok with that. But do not condemn me for consuming a nice juicy succulent humanely raised ribeye steak.
The Mediterranean diet is where its at. More fish, less beef. And always less carbs (the food pyramid is as outdated as the real pyramids!)
I typically don't eat much red meat. I'll have some chicken, pork, or fish for dinner most nights. I also eat a minimum of 5 fruits/veggies a day, about 2 milk servings, and only whole grains. I really think its all part of a balanced diet – no one strictly eats meat who is not a vegetarian.
One of the things that actually keeps me from becoming a vegetarian (because I've thought about it) is the fact that most vegetarians/vegans I've met try to cram it down your throat. Nothing is open to a discussion – you're a terrible person because you eat meat and disgusting and horrible because of it. Perhaps if more vegetarians and vegans were less judgmental, everyone else would be willing to listen to what they say instead of getting defensive and sticking to their "meat is the only way to go" routine. There are very valid arguments for cutting out factory-farmed meats, but I can't stand to be, and won't be, lectured about it. And I don't believe all of her arguments are 100% fact – you can skew the discussion any way you want depending on what you believe when you look at the facts.
Oh – and I will clarify that I don't believe the "cramming it down their throats" mentality only holds true for the anti-meat-eaters. People who are very gung-ho about their meat-eating can also be obnoxious when you order or make a vegetable dish. Then again, I also have the same problem with people and their political or religious agendas. Why can't people actually just present how they feel about a topic instead of viciously attacking those who have a different opinion?!?!
I love how she lays the blame of America's obesity problem on eating meat. Yet the primary culprit is a grain, corn, and all of the glorious products that it has made it's way into. Not that any vegan would admit that.
This argument shouldn't be over whether somebody should be a vegetarian or not. The argument should be that the meat industry needs reform on multiple levels. It is an industry that has perfected a low-cost, high-profit model regardless of the treatment of the animals themselves. At the same time, vegetables, which are an important part of everyone's diet, are being thrown by the wayside and being replaced by fats and sugars (and an overall lazy lifestyle). It's not surprising that this country is obese (which in turn raises health care costs).
I'm not saying don't eat meat, as it's everyone's individual choice. I'm saying that maybe we should all think about what we eat and try to make better choices in regards to our diet.
I personally cannot stand either of these viewpoints as they are extremist, but I must admit at least Jane backed her views up with some valid arguments other than "meat tastes better."
I may be a vegetarian, but I'm not going to say that meat is evil and you shouldn't eat it. To impose one's views upon others is ridiculous and judging from the comments here, many of you fall into that category.
I tend to side with the vegan point of view..... But, I fall victim to the fact that "you can't beat a good steak". Sad, I know.
She points out that the treatment of the animals is the reason for all the salmonella outbreaks... we certainly aren't seeing these types of outbreaks (E Coli) in the veggie world, are we? Peanuts, Spinach, tomatoes, lettuce, spinach again... it just keeps going.
Perhaps the plants aren't being treated humanely. The peanut plants are being forced to grow in dirty soil environments, the tomatoes are strapped into cages, the lettuce gets its head cut off and the spinach... I'm not even going to get started on what they do to that poor, defenseless spinach....
We were born with canines for a reason. I'll stick with beef, etc. Vegans can kill the veggies.
How many acres of natural habitat were razed so your (everyone else's) vegetables and nuts could be grown? NO diet is guilt free.
Not nearly as many as it takes to feed the animals raised for meat. Again, science and math win out the logic side of the argument for not eating meat. I wouldn't expect anyone to gather this from this rubbish of an article though.
look people, its obvious that the carnivores don't want to be vegetarians and the vegetarians don't want to be carnivores. We all have our own beliefs and so let's stick to them. I am a proud vegetarian, and I don't preach to others. But I expect the same from those that eat meat. Let me live my lifestyle and you live yours. Get over it already. No one is going to change their lifestyle from reading comments on CNN.
Wow. Of all the people they could have gotten on here to counter-argue.... this woman gives the rest of us vegans a bad name; living up to the exact thing the original interview was complaining about.
Did they get a nutritionist? No. Did they get a doctor? No. Did they get a biologist? No. Who they got was this overly-emotionally hyped sensationalist who just managed to live up to the stereotype she was defending.
For all the non-veggies eaters out there: Really, once you listen to the intellectual side of the argument, it's difficult to come up with reasons why you should still be eating meat. Biology, sustainability, health, disease, economics, all play a role in the arguments against eating meat. It's not just about this "touchy feely" garbage this article focuses on.
Agreed Jay (see my post right above yours). I wish this article could have been more informative, not only with why to reduce meat intake but with help in how. The problem I'm having as I try to wean off meat (again I will never be totally off) is there just doesn't seem like enough options in a vegetarian diet and it seems more expensive and more effort (vegetables don't stay fresh for very long and you can't freeze them so it seems like constant shopping, etc.). This article was a complete failure in that regard.
I was disappointed in this counter argument. When I saw the headline on the CNN main page that said "5 reasons to be a vegetarian", I was hoping for more than 1) meat is murder 2) meat is murder 3) meat is... I've been trying to cutback considerably on my meat intake but I seriously doubt I'll ever be meat free. Still if all Americans reduced their meat consumption to 3 times per week I think Jane would start seeing the changes in our food culture (factory farming) that she desires. Change is slow and in gradual steps. Start by getting Americans to eat more vegetable only meals several times per week (give info on good, easy cookbooks; discuss different varieties of vegetarian food options; etc.). This was a chance for her to "sell" being a vegetarian and provide answers on how to transition off of a meat heavy diet. Instead she just screamed about why meat is bad. Can't imagine she made many converts with this article. Too bad.
All this "talk" is making me hungry! Time for some bacon and eggs!. After all, it is, a free country!
I never did like her or Nancy just because they make a living from other people misfortune and stupidity. They are not real journalists in my own opinion. They are on the edges of journalism, entertainment journalism I guess. Despicable. As for Jane now I hear her touting vegetarianism. Vegetarianism is fine. It kind of ignores though our natural evolution, how we got here, why we are omnivores and not cows.
I eat meat and I also eat vegies. All though I will not agree about eating meat is bad, (yes I have seen the peta videos)and I do respect the opions given by those who do not eat meat. If I was able to hunt for my own food skin it and all that I would. I live in the city and the most that I have done that is even close to that is fishing. I was able to do all the prep for it and yes I felt good about it the fact that I did the work. I have a great respect for nature and I feel that all is open to me and if an animal ever ate me hey thats nature. Granted I do not wish do die by anything by any means lol, but I get it I understand where the fight comes, but I stand by what I say.
Everyone everywhere thinks that everything everyone does anywhere is 100% their business and that they have a right to tell others what they should be doing. I'm right! No, I'm right! Not you're not, I'm right! And on and on it goes. Land has to be cleared for animal grazing. Land has to be cleared for crops. If 7 billion people stop eating animals, they're going to have to do a lot of farming, which requires clearing land. Where are the animals going to go? They're going to go to the fields and eat because no one is eating them and they are no longer afraid. How are we going to stop them from eating our crops? Well, we can't shoot them anymore because the Vegans say we can't. Put up fences? Well, that would require cutting down trees to make fence posts. How about metal fences? Okay, well, where do we get the ore to make the metal fence? Well, I guess we'll have to cut down some trees to make an access road to an ore dig. And how about the machines to extract that ore? Well, they run on diesel, not pixie dust. Meanwhile, animal populations that we've abandoned are now rampant. But the Vegans won't let us kill any. And around and around we go.
This hot Vegan says we were conditioned to believe in eating meat, yet she wants to condition us to eat Vegan. I like meat because I like meat, not because a magazine told me to, not because my parnets told me to, but because I like it.
Do plants feel pain? Do they have a nervous system? It's difficult to make a conclusive decision on plants when we EXPECT them to have animal-based systems instead of their own. Are we really saying that they're not alive and can't feel anything because they don't have what we animals have? Didn't the U.S. try that mentality before when they said if you don't have what I have (white skin), then you're not entitled to be a citizen, etc.? Some say we can't detect anything, so there is no sense of pain in plants. Just because we can't detect it or have a device to measure it doesn't mean it isn't there.
Her arguments are full of holes. All the vegan epople I know get sick often and look malnurished. No thank you, my energy levels are fine. Pass the steak.
Vegan Lesbo who likes Furr Pie. Lesbos only on SI-NN. Homos like Rick Sanchez-Only on SI-NN.
On a lot of counts she is right, but also humans didn't evolve to today by eating lettures and roots... I agree that factory farms are terrible – thats why small farms should be promoted – there animals are treated differently.
Personally I dont have problem with people eating meat – but I have problem with people who waste it – it makes me sick when people through away uneaten meat. Just think – it was a living animal couple days ago – so dont waste it so that animal didnt die in vain...
None of these arguments stand up. Texas ribeye beats squash any day. If you feel "guilty" about it then don't eat it, but don't try to push your lame feel good vegetarian values on the me. I've got more important things to worry about.
The evolution of our species in clearly in the direction of altruism. This will leave no room for selfish, thoughtless, and inconsiderate omnivores who only respect one species of animal of the millions of species on Earth–human. Serve humans only and humans will be eradicated from the Earth. Treat other sentient beings with respect and the Earth will respect you. All predators are eventually wiped out while the humble and meek WILL inherit the Earth.
This debate is interesting if you look at it from a moral stand point, but her argument is of very narrow scope and heavily biased. Anyone can live whatever life they wish to live, but some of her arguments are just plain wrong – in particular her statements that we are not hard-wired to eat meat. This just isn't true. One of the primary differences that separated our ancestors and other primates is that early hominids began to hunt for their food, and also to cook it. The shift towards this more balanced omnivorous diet fueled the development of larger brains over thousands of years.
Simply stated: yes, we are hard-wired to eat meat for it's energy content alone. That is not to say that we should eat it to excess, and this is the plight of the American diet. Dietitians are always pushing more vegetables for a reason. They are good for you – but don't worry, you don't have to cut out all the meat. Some hypothesize that our culture developed thanks to the invention of cooking, which only came about once our early ancestors began to eat meat. The community gathering about the fire while waiting for a meal to be served is an ancient tradition that has led to the gathering of communities into a civilization.
Most ppl don't go veggie/vegan for the fun of it...or even for health reasons. It's about compassion...it's about ending the suffering. Wish folks would enlighten themselves to a world with limited meat consumption. Factory farms are Hell...a living Hell. My dogs flip when I take them on a car ride to the vet...imagine if they were getting freighted to slaughter...now THAT'S terrifying. I'm not carnivorous...our species never was. We used to feed off of what large predators left behind until the Neolithic Era when we invented stone tools for cutting and tearing...because one look at our teeth and nails will tell ya we can't do crap without a sharp tool. So, change it up...eat whole grains, veggies, beans, and occasionally some fruit...you'll lose weight and have lots more energy. Veg for life <3
"Life is as dear to a mute creature as it is to man. Just as one wants happiness and fears pain, just as one wants to live and not die, so do other creatures" .
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
Hey Kerry, you do realize that beans and whole grains contain anti-nutrients and lectins which are very harmful to the human body right? We have evolved as omnivores and are meant to eat meat from healthy animals, seafood, fruit, and veggies. Tell me one group of people over the history of time that was vegetarian for an extended period of time and thrived... Can't do it? It's because we have evolved to eat meat and certain plants
So harmful? What are you talking about? I'm an active 28 year old weighing 125lbs standing 5'7. I don't have a single problem with digestion...in fact I'm quite regular (TMI?) I eat beans a couple of times a week and whole grains daily. Modern humans have been around for approximately 50k-200k years...however, hominids evolved around 4 mya...so, you tell me how terribly fruit/veggie eaters did on anthropological time scale. Tools are the key my friend...not meat. Originally, we were scavengers...we couldn't kill anything...we got the leftovers. Eventually, we figured out how to make tools to make life easier. Folks walked everywhere using large amounts of energy...so, their moderate meat consumption was consistent with their evolution and lifestyle at the time. Now, we drive
So harmful? What are you talking about? I'm an active 28 year old weighing 125lbs standing 5'7. I don't have a single problem with digestion...in fact I'm quite regular (TMI?) I eat beans a couple of times a week and whole grains daily. Modern humans have been around for approximately 50k-200k years...however, hominids evolved around 4 mya...so, you tell me how terribly fruit/veggie eaters did on anthropological time scale. Tools are the key my friend...not meat. Originally, we were scavengers...we couldn't kill anything...we got the leftovers. Eventually, we figured out how to make tools to make life easier. Folks walked everywhere using large amounts of energy...so, their moderate meat consumption was consistent with their evolution and lifestyle at the time. Now, we drive or fly or bike...or whatever to get where we need to go. Extremely sedentary we've become. Hence, all the fat folks you see at McDonalds and at the deli. We don't need it for survival is my point here. Factory farming is cruel and disgusting. I would prefer if we were a meatless society but that will never happen...so, all i ask is that we are responsible in our meat production and consumption. Certified Humane farming practices...get some!
@Kerry... Just because you do not notice any digestion problems now, does not mean you are not doing damage. Yes, you are still very young and have plenty of time for those lectins and anti-nutrients to take their toll. If you think beans and whole grains don't contain anti-nutrients, lectins, and other toxins, just google or wikipedia it. Beans have been linked to many anto-immune diseases such as Lupus, Huntington's, etc. I agree with you that we are far more sedentary today, however nutrition and lack of sleep play a much larger role. I also agree that Factory Farming is disgraceful, but we shouldn't throwout the baby with the bathwater. Support farms that raise their animals the right way. Check out Robb Wolf's Book "The Paleo Solution"... One of the best books out there
When a cow gets up on two legs, goes to wok five days a week, and starts paying taxes, then you can portray it as a poor suffering animal that deserves to live out its days in peace and tranquility. Until then, it's just a cow, and will soon be a delicious ribeye.
REALLY? That's your comment. Children don't work or pay taxes...should we not care when someone abuses/murders/rapes them? Yikes, dude...get a clue. Then again...let's just send em to slaughter. Mmm...baby meat.
What a warped statement.
What a disappointing response. What a disappointing conversation IN GENERAL. Almost no one responds well to preaching. Furthermore, the meat vs. non-meat argument is not the crux of our nation's problem with food.
We take for granted that we can get meat at any corner grocery store, tomatoes in winter, and exotic produce on a whim. We want food cheap, and we want it fast. We don't care where it comes from, or how it got from the farm to our table. THIS is the problem. It matters less that you eat a diet containing or not containing meat and more that you eat a VARIED diet. It matters where your food comes from. It matters just as much that your animal-based food comes from ethical farmers as it does that your vegetables come from sanitary, safe, and local farms.
Being a vegetarian or vegan does not guarantee that you are are healthy or skinny. I've known a ridiculous number of fat vegetarians.
Until we're all growing/killing/cooking our own food, none of us has the right to spout off sanctimonious opinions. And, as an 18-year vegetarian, I feel pretty comfortable in saying that.
Seriously this was ridiculous, on both sides. Reason number four was the only one that could pretend it was a reasonably well laid out argument for either case. Everything else was just opinion. And reason four didn't really have any facts. She says there are plenty of plants that provide protein. Really, which ones I am honestly curious.
And her argument as to how animals are stacked in crates, and live in such deplorable conditions. I live on a beef farm and I resent that implication. While some farms don't go to the extreme that we do most of these farmers aren't stupid. Their entire economic future is ridding on these animals. They aren't going to treat them like Gods, but they aren't going to risk their health and well being either.
Get off your high horse and realize we have K9 teeth in our mouths for a reason. You want to only eat vegetables, great I applaud your decision to control your destiny. Now quit harping at me and pass the bacon and eggs lady I am trying to enjoy my breakfast.
I have NEVER met a healthy vegan or vegetarian. Ever.
And I know a number of vegan/veget's.
What is really interesting to me is that they like to tell themselves that they are healthy, and in a "superior"way,
even though they are so sickly. I believe the self-delusion stems from their malnourishment.
Vegetable protein is NOT animal protein. Which humans need to be healthy.
Regarding:
Genesis 9:2–3
"The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."
This was written by an ancient egomaniac with delusions of grandeur and very big appetite.
Why does it have to be one way or another - either absolutely no meat at all or that's all you eat and you gorge yourself on it? How about those of us in the middle? Some people eat meat AND vegetables. Not everyone who eats meat eats giant burgers every day. I eat lean red meat, fish, seafood of all sorts.
Also, some people who eat meat are concerned with the welfare of the animals. There are brands and restaurants that I don't eat at because of their practices. Just like there are some pet stores I don't shop at because of how they raise and ship animals.
Being a meat eater doesn't automatically mean I'm a heartless, fat slob. And truth be told, I'll never become vegan if that's how I'm going to be treated as a meat eater.
When I first read Tim Love's article, I thought it was unfair of him to categorize vegetarians as "preachy", but now I see why he said that. This article is not only preachy, but it is self-congratulatory and just plain off-putting. I can think of lots of reasons to be a vegetarian (though I am not one), and yet Velez-Mitchell hasn't pointed out a single one that would actually make anyone want to change their mind about eating meat.
Isn't it great how people see just a few instances of animal abuse and ignorantly asume that those few instances represent the entire industry. Abused animals, stressed animals, or animals in pain don't make money for the farmers, so it's in thier best interest to keep the amimals happy. Anybody seen the comercials for California cheese? The keep saying something like, a happy cow makes better cheese, well it's true.
And for all of those who blurt out statements like, "Why don't you live the life of a farm animal and see how you like it!" Well, to those people, I say, why don't you go live the life of an animal in the wild and see how long you survive. Your entire existence is centered around finding food and not being killed. If you saw a picture of an overweight guy sitting on a couch eating delivered food, and a picture of an Indian, thin from lack of food, which would you think has a more content and fullfilling life? Farm animals have it easy compared to thier wild counterparts. To you vegetarian extremist, stop focusing on your Michael Moore one sided arguments and look at the whole picture, do some actual research, go to a farm, and actually see both sides of the argument.
Simple rule of nature.. You are either a "predator" or "prey". Predators are meat eaters, Prey are vegetarian. Prey have eyes on the side of their heads to watch for Predators (rabbits, deer, horses, etc.). Predators have eyes in front (to hunt for prey). Where are your eyes facing?
Why don't humans eat humans? They are also mammals, afterall. The answer–respect. Why not respect other animals? Answer–we rule, we are top of the food chain–don't need to respect animals. Well...when this planet can no longer sustain us because of greenhouse effects from methane at commercial livestock facilities, you won't be eating animals or veggies. you ominvores will be eating each other..
First, because it's generally taboo. There are plenty of instances where cannibalism has been done not out of survival, but out of respect. However, most of these cultures have been Westernised, so we don't really see it any more.
Second, because eating humans can be deadly. You can get kuru from eating humans - sort of a human version of mad cow disease.
What most people don't realize when they are talking about the treatment of animals is that most are kept in sanitary, well ventilated and healthy conditions. Most vegetarians chose to believe that all animals are treated inhumanly because they are shown the worst examples of the farming industry. The majority of farmers care for their animals because they are their source of income and if they are not treated properly your do not make any money. I invite any person to come onto my parents 400 cow dairy farm and try to tell me that these animals are treated inhumanly.
If it didn't have parents, i aint eating it.
Jane is right on the money. The world and our economy can no longer bear the cost of continuing the barbaric and violent practice of eating meat. For all of you Chirstians who eat meat, think of the GOLDEN RULE. Do onto others as you have them do onto you. This pertains to anything that wants to live freely and not be violated, anything that feels pleasure and pain, whether that animal be human or non-human. Methane from cow fecal pools is a bigger source of greenhouse effect than our cars–no kidding–look it up. Meat increases risk for cancer, diabetes, alzheimer's, and heart disease. And, try this–just stop eating meat for a few months and then go back–it will literally taste like feces!
In fact, hamburger is full of processed feces and urine–no kidding–wake up and look it up-stop living in denial and delusion and you will be a much more fulfilled person.
Rudy, what exactly is a Chirstians?? Is that a new religion????
I do think it's great that you admitted in public that you know what feces tastes like! Awesome, dude! Now that you've taken the first step, we can continue on with your therapy!!
Don't throw the baby out with the bath water Rudy... Not all meat is bad. Factory Farming is a sad and disgraceful practice but meat from healthy, free-range animals that are fed their natural diet is not only healthy but essential to a good diet. As humans we need Vitamin B-12 that comes from animals to survive. Try eating a paleo Diet for a month and get back to me...
Why do people try to say that animals and people are the same thing. People clearly have a higher brain function then all animals. Animals do not have the capacity to feel emotions or to develop any long term mental suffering. They do not have the sections of the brain to do so. All animals thought and mental prosess come from natural evolutionary and survival parts of the brain. Not feeling and emotions. As for the Christian arguement, in Genisus God gives man power over all the living things of the world. Don't people think that their energy can be better spent helping the hundred of thousands of homeless children in our own country then worrying about animals. I know for a fact these children feel scared and sadness when they go to bed hungry every night. I'm sure they would appreciate people wasting there time trying to save a pig.
Vegetarian – an old Indian (Native American) word that roughly means "doesn't hunt so well"...
Hey, come on....let's be fair! They can sneak up on a pumpkin, and harvest it with the best of them! And corn? It doesn't stand a chance!!
Well said, Jane!
For all those who want to eat meat, I challenge you to go visit the slaughterhouses where your meat supplies are coming from, and see where you stand after that.
A visit to the slaughterhouse is what turned me into a meat eater.
Good times.
all you will eat meat when a zombie apocalypse happens. natural instinct of a zombie is to consume flesh human and animal. have fun!
all you will eat meat when a zombie apocalypse happens. natural instinct of a zombie is to consume flesh human and animal. have fun.
Too bad people don't get this worked up over the millions of babies that are aborted every year.
I wonder what Jane Valez-Mitchell would have had the Eskimos eat? Ice? Kind of hard to grow veggies in the ice. Vegetarianism is fine for those who want to follow it, but I will eat what the LORD has given to me.
Genesis 9:2–3
"The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."
Abortion has nothing to do with this issue. Neither does the tea in China have anything to do with this article. Stick to the subject at hand. Debate the issue, not abortion. If you want to debate abortion, then go to an article about abortion and write to your heart's content. That is irrelevant to this issue. Child abuse is bad, elderly abuse is bad, lots of things are bad and if you want to debate them, then please do in the proper forum.
I am soo trying not to be rude here Tom, but what does abortion have to do with eating/not eating vegetables?
I've been a vegetarian for over 30 years and I can't STAND preachy, propoganda-spouting idiots like the author of this article. We're all free to make our choices and what you eat is your business, not mine.
By the same token, I wish people would stop asking me why I DON'T eat meat like I'm some kind of freakshow – really, it's a personal choice and I don't want to give to give a speech, I just want to eat my dinner!
Sorry, honey, but you're not going to win many fans with your lame reasoning.
5 reasons why eating meat beats the heck out of being a vegetarian:
1. BEEF
2. HAM
3. BACON
4. RIBS
5. DID I MENTION BACON??
Vegetables are meant to be a side dish. Don't forget the butter!!
That's right, vegtables are what my food eats.
I'm beginning to think American's have lost their minds! First off, what does abortions (Anna) have to do with being a vegetarian or not. And Anna, listen to this carefully. I have know women personally who were made to have babies they did not want, and don't tell me a woman can grow to love a child conceived by rape. Maybe you can and would, but don't put ALL WOMAN IN THAT! Second of all, I thought living in America was about choice. The choice to live free, work hard, respect and love your neighbor. Now that does not mean that I agree with large farm practices. I grew up in the South. When it was time to kill a chicken, my aunt would put the chicken up in a separate cage for about ten days, so it couldn't scavenge around. On killing day, the chicken's neck would be broken and the blood drained, feathered and gutted. Now that was a good meal! And us kids participated when we got to be a certain age. It was important to the ol' folks that us kids knew how and where we got our food. Oh, I forgot. Nobody wants their kids to know how they got their food, they want their kids to think ITS MAGIC! And last but not least, if YOU don't want to eat meat "I ain't mad with ya", but please please, leave me the hell alone!
What can you do when you are not a great cook and don't care for most vegetables? I would like to at least give up red meat and pork, but where will I get protein from if I don't consume poultry, fish and seafoods? Genuinely distressed by this issue.
How disappointing. CNN, if you wanted to counter-act the past article, find a Vegan that has a clue what she is talking about. This i the preachy crap that was discussed in the article, and rather than give us give reason being vegan is 'good' she attacked the previous article. A lot of her information is misguided, twisted, and CNN should be ashamed to put it up. Yes, American's overeat but being vegan is not natural for our bodies. There is no food choice that is better than the other, but is someone personal preference.
Really, neither article should have been posted by CNN. It just seems a shame after the great 5@5 that was posted yesterday. Get this crap off your site, please?
As usual, stupid defensive responses from fat meat eaters with bad skin. Tim wrote an inflammatory article to advertise his business to people who aren't bright enough to figure it out. Jane responded to his article in defense of being a vegetarian because he was criticizing vegetarians. So I wonder, if meat eaters are so happy and confident with their lifestyle choice why would they click on her response, let alone comment? You think your drivel will change one vegetarian's opinion. Heavy meat eaters die early and no one will miss them so who cares what they eat.
We can only hope you're one of them, Lila. Have some bacon!
i love how in this article meat is continuously blamed for obesity, because potato chips and soft drinks have nothing to do with it.
You vegetarians are just as bad as the meat eaters. Deforestation happens for both meat and vegetable products which kills tons of animals a day and dont say "I get organic food", unless it is hand picked then the farmer uses a machine to pick the product and the unless you are willing to eat just apples and oranges you are killing animals just as much as we are the harvesters and pesticides kill tons of animals a day. Also plastic glass and metal has some paper product on it as a label or some part of it is going to kill an animal harvesting the ore for the product. Your trash from the packaging goes to the landfill that also kills animals all the time. Also go to the museum of natuarl history in DC and look at the dinosaurs. The vegetarians dinosaurs have flat teeth this is for eating just plants, while the carnivores have sharp teeth this is for eating meat. Our teeth are 50/50 so we are designed for both. We also have an appendix which we do not use anymore because we cook our food now but it was designed to process raw "meat". I agree with the don't kill animals at a mass quanity and eating more vegetable based meals but i like to eat meat. I get my meat from a local market where they get their meat from local farmers and I know they don't miss treat them because I drive by it everyday on my way to work.
Animals eat animals all the time. Why should I not be able to?
Man has been an omnivorve for millions of years but we (just now in the last 30) force our children to eat meat? Also most meat is not produced on these imaginery factory farms that you mention. I lived around farmers all my life and have never seen what you describe as a factory farm. If they exists then they should be banned. Farmers need to make money and all the animals I have seen free range . This process gets the most production from the animal whether it is milk or meat.
Anyone ever eat Veal? MMMMM...baby cow = DELICIOUS!
Give me that Filet o Fish, Give me that Fish !!!
Hey sweetheart, I don't eat rotting carcasses and plates of "swimming blood". And there is no evidence that all of the vegans in the world ever saved the life of one cow.
I just genuinely enjoy vegetables, fruits, carbs, etc better than meat. I don't really like the taste of meat, except for bacon. I'm not quasi-vegetarian for a moral reason, or a health reason, or for the environment, just taste. I can't stand overly preachy vegetarians and vegans like this woman... it gives vegetarians a bad name and just perpetuates the cycle of self-righteous vegetarians and aggressive meat lovers.
@PLP a2z "She can have a taste of my meat." Oh, please. You sound like a chauvinist high school dropout from Arkansas. I'm not saying she's any better, Miss Holier Than Thou, but let's all put our big kid pants on and use valid arguments rather than crude innuendo.
Snobby elitist? For not needing some poor creature to DIE so a human can slaver all over it? Guess I am an elitist, too. Mammals all get here the same way. I have not touched meat in years, and I don't plan to ever again. At least I am a HEALTHY snob, and nothing had to die for me! We are and always will be a nation of savages.
@Hannah... you do realize the plants that you are eating had to die for you to eat them right? Just because they don't show emotion in the same fashion as mammals doesn't mean they don't feel pain and suffering...
I was a vegetarian for 7 years. I was also married to a strict vegan. I finally starting eating meat again because I was so unhealthy. I did everything I could to get the proper amount of protein but it was nearly impossible to do. So for the sake of my health, I started eating meat again. I only eat meat about three times a week. I love the taste of certain meats and I eat them guilt-free. Yet, my favorite restaurant is a vegan and vegetarian restaurant.
It is a personal decision if somebody wants to be a vegetarian or a vegan, and I respect their wishes if that is what they so choose. I just wish they would respect mine in eating meat. Most of them (like Jane Valez-Mitchell) are so self-righteous and it gives vegetarians and vegans a bad name.
she's an idiot. HOT! but an idiot...why do vegans answer different questions with the same answers?
instead of just calling her an "idiot," why not rebut her comments? because you can't and just prefer name-calling? yes, I knew that was it.
I was vegetarian cook for 20 yrs & was chronically ill until I started red-meat-centered diet 15 years ago & instantly became well. To vegetarians I say "good for you", but not for everyone.
funny, I had the opposite experience-I had stomach issues until I stopped eating meat. Sounds to me that you weren't really a vegetarian cook and that you're making things up now so people think your knowledgeable. If you WERE a vegetarian cook, you'd know what you should eat in order to stay healthy. If your personal choice is to eat meat, fine, but don't lie about it.
Wow, Polly. So, because you simply disagree with someone, now they're a liar? I'd call you unsympathetic to others, and undeserving of having anyone listen to your opinion. Because that's what it is, an OPINION. Get a life already, would you?
Polly, what I said is 100% true. I was even an ethical vegetarian activist. Some people can be healthy without meat, I know several who've been for 30+ years. Others get sickly, bad complexion, hair loss, and worse. These people know their nutrition, eat balanced meals, veg protein etc.. Vegetarian militants ("meat is murder") believe a lot of myths.
Save a cow, eat a vegan
they taste like Chicken
yet another inane joke that every vegetarian/vegan has heard a billion times. At least be original with your disrespect for other people's life choices.
We could eliminate world hunger if, instead of concentrating all that food into meat, we fed it directly to starving people."
This type of attitude is most distasteful about vegetarians. Do not they know that food that animals eat mostly is not for human consumption. How about this lady eating some grass and hay, grade 3 corn and some leafy plants.
One good reason to be a vegetarian she didn't mention: your poop smells better. Or rather, not as bad.
TIm Love is an idiot. There are valid reasons to eat meat, but his arguments are specious and are based on personal preference. The vegetarian/vegan rebuttal was nicely done, although based primarily on her personal principals. Most people don't give a damn about overcrowding or the health conditions of the meat they are consuming.
Don't you get it people? Jane Velez-Mitchell is the equivalent of an internet troll.
If you don't know what that is just look it up on wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29
She is the CNN version of Fox news in the sense that they make money by saying outrageous things just to keep people watching.
I like her style! Troll it, girl!
Duck season....wabbit season...duck season...wabbit season...broccoli season......hmmmm...just doesn't work.
What baffles me is how so many filthy rednecks learn to write and post on the sites. Even more baffling is why they picked a stinking redneck to do this interview
I love fresh veggies with my meat.
We'll all die around the same time anyway.
Some will die healthy and some will die unhealthy
No single food choice has a farther-reaching and more profoundly positive impact on our health, the environment, and all of life on Earth than choosing vegan. It's no wonder that Einstein said "Nothing will benefit human health and increase chances of survival for life on earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet."
Wow, one of the most misguided articles I have ever seen. It is disappointing that she has obviously done very little research in the field of Anthropology and Nutritional Sciences. Vegan is NOT a healthy lifestyle to take on. I will agree with her that Factory Farming is a sad practice and should be banned, however, meat is NOT bad for you. Loads of carbohydrates especially in the form of grains IS bad for you. If you eat well over 200g of Carbohydrate a day, you are at a far greater risk of developing Syndrome X. Avoid grains, legumes, and dairy if possible. As humans they produce far greater damage to the body than they are worth. They are calorically dense and nutritonally deficient. Eat free-range animals fed their natural diets, wild seafood, veggies, and fruits and watch your health soar. If she thinks that the human digestive system is the same as a horse, cow, goat, etc. she is sadly mistaken and misled. I truly hope that people do not believe what this woman has to say or think like her because her mindset is completely off course with how humans have evolved to eat.
1. There are nutrients our bodies need that can only be found in meats... You can take supplements for it, but if we were supposed to eat meat why would the nutrients we need be in there??
2. It isn't meat that is making America Fat, it's the fried foods and portions. Super sized orders of french fries and extra ranch dressing, loaded potatoes, fried cheese, overloaded plates of pasta and carbs...
3. The number of misspellings and typos in her rebuttal almost killed me... I hope writing is just a hobby for her.
What an overwhelmingly snobby, elitist *&#^@ that woman is. Not every one who eats meat is obese. Nor is every vegetarian healthy. Meat and dairy is not why people are overweight. Unhealthy choices are why people are overweigh (mind you that is not a hardened fast rule). I think junk food and a more sedentary lifestyle by many is why obesity is a problem in the US.
I was going to read this article with an open mind. Then in the first paragraph she refered to meat as rotting carcass. I didnt waste my time. If shes not going to be serious, neither am I.
She actually made his arguement for him by coming off as a sanctimoious bitch.
Animals eat animals. Humans should not be killing and eating animals. Why lower yourself?????
Right, eat a human instead! You do realize humans are animals, right? You do know we have canines (those are the pointy teeth) for a reason right? They are not for mashing down vegatables. That is what your back teeth are for, right?
Think before you post.
My point exaclty Grant, humans who eat animals are just like animals. Humans should not be eating animals, period. It is not natural. It is a bad habit that has continued over time. I am sure that if everyone had to kill, cut, clean and cook their own cow or pig or chicken or lamb, there would be very few meat eaters left in this world. Why is it that meat eaters don't like it if you discuss the slaughter process at the dinner table - THEY CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!
I'm guilt free when I eat a burger or steak. If it's your choice not to eat meat great, I don't care. But leave me alone on my choice too.
Sometimes I don't understand, I guess its a free country. But what happended to us that we think eating somethng we've been eating since the beginning of time is bad?
I do not reside on top of the food chain to be eating green grass!
aren't plants living things too???
top of the food chain, i dont think a predator in nature feels bad for their prey
this is ridiculous
If god meant people only to eat plants, we'd have eyes on the side of our heads like a rabbit.
Does anybody find it ironic that this article come out right at the beginning of deer season? It gave me a good laugh as I was getting my bow ready for Bambi!!!
Could you define "socially conditioned to enjoy" cause I am one picky eater and I don’t generally like things that most people consider "delicious" so I consider myself to only eat what I want and definitely NOT what is considered "socially acceptable".
AND ALSO.. why do ALL vegan people need to get ugly when defending their personal choice? The constant term "rotting carcass" is only said to provoke and in all honesty I just tune them out when they start down that road. Vegans would do much better if they would present their case in a calm and confident manner and leave all the nasty references out of it.. any intelligent person can make a decision without the need to be reminded about how pig are raised.. I already knew and YES CAN I HAVE A SECOND SERVING OF BACON... YUMMMY BACON.... oh man I am getting hungry..
I dont call their food names and I don’t look down on them for not eating meat... heck I'm glad when there is a vegetarian at the bbq, that means that there will be seconds of the Fillet Minon' for me, YAY! God I LOOOOVVEEE STEAK!
so much for not being preachy.
Nobody likes a vegetarian.
Ten billion animals slaughtered each year – in the US alone. Some probably smarter than your cat or dog.
SUGAR is responsible for the Obesity in America. NOT MEAT!
Yup!
Sugar. Inactivity. Huge portions.
35-40 GRAMS of sugar per soda. Why don't you measure out that much sugar someday, it might just change your opinion on soda. I don't drink the crap anymore, but apparently we think it should be a staple beverage.
Ironically, when compared one to one, a single beer is far healthier than a single soda.
Vegetarians and vegans are all overlooking one simple fact: Biology. The human body has evolved over millions of years into an omnivore. While it is POSSIBLE to get the nutrients that the body needs from plant sources, the simple fact is that it takes excessive diligence to do so. A healthy diet that includes a fair, but not overdone, portion of meat is the most healthy diet.
YES, there are far to many mistreated animals in the food industry. YES, Americans do eat too much meat. But to try to completely banish meat from your diet is simply stupid. You don't want to harm cute animals, so you eat leaves and twigs. If you want to, go ahead, but don't preach to me about it. The science simply doesn't back you up.
There are no reasons to be a vegetarian. Humans are not designed to live solely on vegetables.
Besides, meat is tasty and good for you.
Well, neither one of them gives straight up answers on the benefits of either side; both of them argue from an emotional stance that in the end answers nothing. For the record, I am an omnivore; I've gone through periods of being a vegetarian, but ultimately missed meat too much to stay. Lest you think that's simply preference, I found that even well made, nutrionally sound vegetarian meals just did not keep me feeling full for very long. Frankly, I got tired of feeling hungry after only an hour or so. Note that I said "...well made, nutrionally sound...," yet I still felt that way. On the other hand, yes the conditions the animals are raised in are awful – but that is a moral statement only, so it only carries a little weight. From a more rational standpoint, the need for all the antibiotics & other chemicals that is caused by this does result in food that has negative effects on us. Addtionally, a vegetarian or vegan diet does make more efficient use of our natural resources. Ultimately, that may be the factor that drives us to less meat. For now, I've cut back quite far on my meat consumption; in the end, that last reason may be the catalyst that makes me "go all the way" permanently.
I think this article was needed to balance out the other one (one extreme view in turn of another). What I would love to see published would be a discussion of some less extreme options, though...for those of us who do not wish to become vegetarian, but who wish to eat meat that was produced in a humane way. I do not agree that eating meat is inhumane. I think that it is part of the natural order, and that even though people can survive as vegetarians, they live in the most healthy way by consuming meat in a very modest way (not every day, and not as a main course). I think it is terrible that, aside from the obvious cruelty on factory farms, they have also made organic meat unaffordable for many people who would otherwise buy it.
Again, if you're into meat, then STFU and take responsibility for your choice by rejecting factory-farmed meat whenever possible... or better yet, hunt it yourselves... support local farmers at the least. Your health and local economy will thank you for it.
Although I agree with what she is trying to say I just don't think she made the meatless argument very well. All of her points were not actual points of but the regurgitated diatribe you hear most vegetarians/vegans use in their arguments against meat.
I support meatless diets but she just came off without any convincing reasons why and preachy.
Whilst I am largely pro-vegetarian (live that lifestlye 5 days a week for health reasons) I do find the replies to the pro-meat argument sanctimonius. Seriously, if I looked at life the way she does I would quit normal society and join a monastery...
She did an excellent job, and if taxpayer subsidization of the meat industry were stopped and the real cost of a pound of beef were reflected in the price tag (about $30 / lb) then more Americans would either be taking a personal responsibility for their meat by hunting/raising it themselves or going vegetarian like she suggests. For billions of poor people around the world, eating meat isn't an option. They simply can't afford it. Ever wonder why beef costs more than broccoli? Taxpayer subsidies are your answer... vegetables are much cheaper to raise than cattle. And don't even get me started on the hormones and antibiotics... if you're not ready to go vegetarian (I'm not either) then at least do your part to shut these factories down by supporting local farmers who slaughter their animals themselves and raise them in at least halfway decent conditions.
If she's eating a "rotting carcass", then somebody really doesn't know how to shop.
For me, it's not about vegan vs meat. Biblically, if one believes that way, humans were given 'dominion' over the animals. Does that mean eating them? That's a personal call. Raised on a farm, at one time I loved meat. I stopped eating meat because it no longer has any taste and I have no know of how long its been rotting since it was killed. Fact is, it is rotting flesh pumped with preseravtives, ergo all the dry rubs and marinades on the market today, to give meat 'flavor.' Meat use to have flavor; it was called 'meat.' It use to be safe for human consumption, honestly, I don't trust it anymore. If a cow, pig, and chicken exist just fine without eating meat, I think I can too, but again, it's my personal choice. Find what works for you.
Humans unfortunately were not "given" anything.Man cannot compete with mother nature with out his own doom.Reason why I commented.Is your second sentence.Sorry.To me that's a ignorant point of view.Just my opinion.Do some research?Please.Beside the bible.
Lame and Preachy answers from the Vegan. Funny and Witty answers from the Omnivore. No need to say anything more.
I like how she took the protein argument and basically twisted what he said to give herself a fake 'point' in this ridiculous debate, when he had already said to eat meat in moderation. This is America, if I want to eat meat, I'm gonna eat meat and you can take your vegan high-and-mightiness elsewhere.
Also – "I defy anybody to look at those pig gestation crates and walk away with a hankering for a slice of bacon." – I have, eat some bacon soon after; your move.
" How can you talk about peace if your plate is swimming in blood? " – Easy, go where you're not currently at and eat my meal. Was that a trick question?
" Rainforests are being leveled to create grazing land." – And farmland. Oh wait.... that contradicts your view, so you didn't list it, right?
Five Reasons to Be a Vegetarian: .. ..
And Ten Reasons to have a balanced diet including meats, oysters, shrimp, eggs, pork and steak...
Fill in the blanks
Eat what ever you want.Just these articles are completely pointless.Everyone has a opinion.Seems after reading this article.Both arguments are invalid.One is a closed minded Texan.The other a P.E.T.A investor/animal lover.Who would save a puppy rather then a starving child.Some of these comments are mind blowing.I am a omnivore.Man was since the start.Our teeth proves this fact.Just when I read "I would much rather devour a piece of well-seasoned squash than a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass. It’s guilt-free eating, which is ultimately more pleasurable"I.
Really?So eating meat is guilty?You know Squash is alive correct? With that reason.You shouldn't eat anything besides rock's.
TL:DR Americans really need to do research them self before watching tv and then finding the need to prove everyone else wrong.
"over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis"
are you kidding me? I live in Belgium, people consume just as much (if not more) meat and dairy here. Same with when I was living in Japan. But there are very few obese Belgians and Japanese compared to America. The problem is America's domination by fast food restaurants and lack of public transportation so Americans just drive everywhere and never walk.
God provided us with mean to eat and even states in the New Testament that what He gives should not be considered "unclean" or undesirable. If it comes down to her opinion or what God says...um....she loses every time. Enjoy your squash.
Idk where CNN finds these people, but Jane and Tim are some of the worst writers I've ever seen. Completely subjective writing. I could care less about what these two idiots "think" is right.
"Children often naturally shun the taste of meat but are forced by their misguided, although well-meaning, parents into eating it anyway."
I'm sorry, but I've grown up around (and helped babysit) four nephews and none of them at any time ever "shunned" meat. It was just another kind of food on the plate. If anything, they shunned vegetables...it's always difficult to get them to eat all of their broccoli. And keep in mind, none of the four are "overweight."
People who eat vegetables are causing animals to starve to death. You're stealing their food!
I lost interest in the article at #3. Poorly debated and lacks variety of perspective. Jane Velez-Mitchell should contribute to the help towards the victims of floods in Pakistan and after that, think about her pigs. It's a pity the world has never been focused enough.
these aren't real arguments to what the meat eater said – these are guilt trips and we don't care, give me my steak
I cite this NPR story that explains how meat may have actually made us smarter: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=128849908
Thank you Jane!!!! I love your show and all that you do for the animals. Thank you for being a voice of reason and sanity in this world.
Go into the woods for about a week and a half and I bet your vegan ass would love a nice crab cake or steak on the grill. as they say In NY.... GET OUTA HEREE!!
Eat whatever you want, be happy doing it, and mind your own business. nom in peace.
Nevermind all the guilt stuff... The concept of eating something that derives much of its flavor from blood is just plain gross.
Both of these people are extreme on either side of the argument. Last time I checked neither of them had a PHD in medicine so I think it would be wise to take their opinions on health benefits and draw backs on either food with a grain of salt!
I think this story made me want to join PETA... People Eating Tasty Animals!
MEAT gotta have it.
To say that meat causes obesity is ridiculous. I changed my eating habits recently. I eat approximately 60% meat & eggs, 30% vegetables, and 10% fruit & nuts. I don't eat grain or grain-based products. I've dropped 45 pounds in the last 5 months. My bad cholesterol has dropped, good cholesterol risen. These are the facts of my experience.
The vegetable is full of it. IF we are what we eat, then that lady is a vegetable. Just propaganda, pure and simple. Why don't these bleeding hearts who are so concerned about animals' "rights" care about the rights of unborn human babies?
They are insane.
Now I'm going to fry me up a big, thick, juicy steak, and I'll have a delicious pork loin roast on Sunday.
I used to raise and slaughter my own pigs and I'll tell you that I never felt even the smallest amount of guilt. If you want to eat nothing but vegetables feel free but quit your damn bitching to us meat eaters. We honestly don't give a rat's ass what you have to say. Anyone one of you that thinks what you're doing makes you a better person should be slapped across the face with a prime rib.
Human beings are not designed to eat:
too much meat
too much dairy
too much corn
too many grains
too much soy
anything close to the amount of sugar we do now
But we are omnivores... so strip out all the politics and ethics... and what is left for a healthy diet are what we evolved to eat over millions of years before the agricultural age flooded us with mutant grains and veggies thousands of years ago, and hormone fed animal products. Different regions and cultures have built different tolerances to their particular delights. No one "modern" diet is perfect, because they are all flawed. The end
While Velez-Mitchell's arguments are sound arguments for improving the meat and dairy industries, they are not good arguments for becoming a vegetarian. While it is true that we eat more meat than we need, eating meat alone is not the reason we are fat Americans. Over eating in general, eating too many high-calorie processed foods, eating too much sugar, drinking too many sodas, those are the reasons we are overweight, not eating meat. No matter what a vegetarian tells you, theirs is not a “morally superior” lifestyle. If raising animals and slaughtering them for food is “immoral,” then the whole freaking universe is immoral. Being vegetarian will not extend your life one second. We all have an expiration date and there is noting that you can do to push your lifespan beyond that date. Eating lentils and tofu for the rest of your life won’t make you live one second longer. Finally, I don’t mind my food swimming in blood, in fact that rare porterhouse steak right off the grill floating in a puddle of steaming blood is just the ticket and I won’t let some holier-than-thou, self-righteous vegan gas-bag tell me otherwise.
It's only a matter of time, I think, before the majority of humans become vegetarian, even vegan. It's the evolutionary process we have gone, and will go, through. We, all, know that it is better for our health to do so. Forget, for a moment, the harm to animals; vegetarianism/veganism is, simply, better for our health.
I tried to go vegetarian/vegan years ago. Didn't last. Constantly on the go, fast food joints were the only choices for that life style. Burger King offered a veggie burger which tasted quite good but, not as filling as a beef burger. And the cost in comparison to a regular beef burger! Besides, I still consumed grease with those veggie burgers (or so it seemed) plus the grease from the fries. After about a week of eating nothing but, basically, salads, I was willing to kill for animal grease, which is the taste I (we) crave, produced by cooking meat products.
This article has me thinking about trying veggies once more. At sixty years of age with cholesterol and early diabetes setting in, I should be eating mostly veggies anyway. Should have eaten veggies my whole life; if I had, perhaps the ol' pecker would still function–I have the desire but not the capacity. Perhaps cholesterol has clogged the tiny capillaries and veins preventing its function. It's too late for me. But not for you young studs out there. Think about it.
If one can get past all the rabid posts for this article and focus on the basic message of Ms. Velez-Mitchell one would be able to see that eating meat is not only condoning the horrific conditions Big-Argribusiness keeps animals but contributes to the large carbon footprint each of us leave with our diet each day. That carbon footprint, measuring the amount of energy that is required to get the meat to market, is enormous. This means, quite simply, that we have to continue to import oil from OPEC reducing our ability to maintain an anti-terrorist stance. Yes, eating meat does, in its own way, help terrorists to attack us. For those of your unable to read anything in a paragraph other than one or two words that set you off, may you learn to read for comprehension and eat for the health of yourself and the country.
How embarrassing. Swine flu has little to do with pigs!!! That's one reason its real name is H1N1. And a great deal of food poisonings comes from vegetables – lettuce, spinach, salad bars, etc.!!! Additionally, cattle and other domesticated animals utilize ground where crops can not be cultivated – producing food where food could not otherwise be grown. And the methane argument? Methane comes from decomposing plants – some of which is in a cow's stomach. Kills the cows and the plants will still produce methane. Really – this is embarrassing to display such ignorance in cyberspace.
Ignoring issues of health, ethics, conditions of farms & animal treatment, these two articles are the perfect example of why the current vegan/vegetarian argument will never ever ever work. It's an issue of rhetoric. It's a similar problem extremely conservative evangelical Christians face in modern society. You will never convert the masses to your way of thinking by listing all of the ways what they're doing is BAD/WRONG/EVIL/DISGUSTING.
The original pro-meat article is mostly light-hearted in tone and talks about why he ENJOYS meat. He even concedes at various points that he's had great vegetarian food and that eating meat in excess is bad for you. His entire argument is mostly centered around "Hey, I like meat."
This response however is based around telling people that they are WRONG WRONG WRONG. At no point does Ms. Mitchell talk about how much she enjoys what she eats. She doesn't talk about the delicious options, about her favorite dishes or the smell of a good ratatouille cooking. She provides no room for acceptance of those who don't share her views (while Tim says he doesn't care what other people eat so long as they let him eat what he likes). It's all or nothing for her.
My wife is largely vegetarian (she just doesn't like the taste of 99% of all meat), so since meeting her my diet has shifted mostly that way as a matter of practicality (not worth making two dinners every night). I still enjoy a burger from time to time, love fish, ribs etc. but it's in extreme moderation now. What I've learned is that there are some absolutely fantastic vegetarian foods out there (vegan is trickier as I haven't found really good cheese or honey alternatives). Indian cooking is by and large vegetarian, and is some of the most flavorful, aromatic, satisfying food on the planet. Same with much of Asian cooking. There are few things I enjoy more than the smell of fresh veggies cooking in a pan with a bit of olive oil and garlic.
She didn't win me over to the vegetarian side of things by preaching or pontificating like some of my other vegetarian friends tried. Instead she showed me the direct positives. You win people over with positives, not negatives. Until the modern vegetarian/vegan movement gets this and shifts away from the shock-n-awe method of argument, they're not going to get anywhere.
Unbelievable! An intelligent post on CNN!
+10
I enjoy eating meat. A lot. Nothing better than a really nice steak (with some good mushrooms, peppers, onions, and maybe broccoli sauteed on the side... give me the squash too, actually). I'm not hiding from the fact that my meal had to die. Let's take veal. I'll kick that baby cow's tender legs myself. So. Delicious. Am I heartless? Most predators don't even kill their catch before they eat it, they just eat it as it bleeds to death. Humans could decide to be better you say? I don't think not killing animals IS better. I believe I have a RIGHT to kill and eat cows if I want. Animals have the right to kill other animals if they are going to eat them. Not to mention, if we didn't EAT all these animals, they wouldn't exist anyway.
I will also continue buying women fur coats, thank you. My level of concern for the feelings of the dead minks is 0. Go get a real cause.
Just simple question,
Ok, let’s say that it would be possible to change things. In short, we will agree with all the farmers or producers of meat, that animals should be treated in a good way before we make steaks of them.
And let’s say this is really the case (I can agree that sometimes animals will not be treated in a good at this moment)
But like I said, this is really the case. Then what?
Would you eat it Jane? The only thing that I read is that you do not eat meat because of the bad conditions of the animals.
And things like fast food, yah, I agree on that, do not like it and taste like very salt cheap meat.
But there are also situations where animals are been treated in a good way. And that the meat taste great.
Well at least in my country we have that (we also have bad conditions of course).
But at least the veggies work for your looks!. Have nice day all of you!.
Grtz.
"we have a generation that doesnt know evil they never suffered the dont know nazism they don't know communism the dont know death camps so they are so naive the belive the real evil is done to animals"-Penn And Teller:Bullshit
jane, you look nothing like your picture. like the pic better. i use to watch your show but dont anymore. you keep saying war on women...that's not true, its war on men too. you make everything sound so shocking and more than it is. i think that's no much and just trying to get ratings and views.
Let me start out by saying that i completely support those who are vegetarian. many of my best friends are vegetarians and I even tried it for a little bit (it wasn't for me). With that said I understand arguments that maybe its healthier (i don't necessarily agree, different people need different diets to maintain a healthy weight, vegetarian may work for someone but not for another). I can also understand arguments that vegetarianism is a greener lifestyle and that meat production produces run-off and greenhouse gases because it does. I also agree that mass production of meat fosters animal cruelty. If I had the resources and money I would eat certified cage free only. But what I do have a problem with is when morality is brought into it. Morals have nothing to do with it. Animals kill animals, its nature and its unavoidable. The fact that we kill in mass numbers is a product of the fact that humans are smarter or at least more equipped to do so. If lions could do so trust me they would. Its survival of the fittest. The fittest are the most able to support themselves with as much ease as possible. Humans have "perfected" the process but not the implementation. With that said I try to limit my consumption of meat and eat mainly fish
Tim Love is an idiot!!! NO, SERIOUSLY!! he could be the worst chef in america, as well as the worst restaurant owner. I used to work for him, his restaurants are FILTHY, DIRTY, and he does not keep his meat fresh at all!! I can't tell you how many times i saw him serve borderline fresh meat. So many of his employees quit because he would lash out at them for questioning it. I would not eat at one of his restaurants if you paid me!!! As for the vegan issue, i love my beef, but a vegetarian day every once in a while is always nice fr the system.
Eat meat and sustain the slimming industry, insomnia industry, low self-esteem industry, iron ore industry, hunting industry. When a live body consumes dead flesh, the dead flesh becomes live flesh eventually. No wonder most of us are 200 pounds or higher.
We are animals, no better than the ones we are killing and eating,we just have the bigger brains. Also ever notice how this type of thining goes on in the richer countries? Whats the latest news on the Animal Liberation Front stationed in Somolia? Nothing. because it doesnt exsist.
If you need me, I'll be eating dinner at Tim Love's place.
She seems quite ignorant in her paragraphs, specifically #4, he said "In moderation" yet she jumped the gun and went on a rant about protein and how we're all becoming obese because we aren't vegans. I like my meat, and in moderation it is part of a healthy balanced diet. Balancing your diet is what is key, you don't need to become a vegan merely because you are sick with the thought this used to be an animal.
Shut up woman! Nothing you can do is going to change the natural fact that we are animals and it just so happens that we're at the top of the food change. You ungrateful harlet! Go home and eat some grapes!
Been nice chatting with you all. I'm gonna get my gun and go drive down the freeway now ...
1) well-seasoned squash VS a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass
Let's be fair. How about we slap a piece of rotting squash on your plate? When you make a fair comparison your points may be better received. This is then followed by generalizing that people "brainwash" their children into eating meat. If this is the case, why did humans ever turn to eating meat? If one studies human history it is found that modern human intelligence exploded shortly after humans turned to a high protein diet derived from... MEAT!
2) I'm sorry that the smell of bacon makes you sad. You know what makes me sad? The gas given off by vegetarians/vegans. It's far from pleasant! Crusade for changes where the animals are housed. Or, don't. I suspect living conditions is a very small point to a group who would prefer to see all humans stop eating meat. I mean... If the animals were suddenly living the best lifestyle possible would this crusade to stop eating meat come to an end? NO!
3) I challenge the idea that anyone can eat meat 'in peace.'
I invite you to my home. I'll eat as much steak in front of you as possible. At the end, as I smoke my cigar and enjoy a drink, you will see the peace that comes over me. Do you parade yourself each day in clothes made by low wage labor? What about those greens you're eating? Do you feel at peace knowing what you do about immigrant workers in the fields picking your vegetables? Or, that those fields now take up land once called home by wildlife?
"Rainforests are being leveled to create grazing land."
- also being cleared to grow crops!
"Also, factory farm run-off – yes I’m talking about all that animal waste – is creating a run-off pollution crisis that is threatening our rivers and oceans."
- Lest we forget so soon, how many salad/spinach, etc. recalls were there? I'm sure you believe that the fertilizers and pesticides used for your veggies don't present much of a "run-off pollution crisis"... Do some research on the Salton Sea and what agriculture can do to its surroundings.
"Finally, there’s world hunger: the greatest health risk on the planet. There are almost a billion hungry people in this world. About one in seven humans do not get enough food."
- Political factors make distribution of food to those who need it nearly impossible. It has nothing to do with food being unavailable.
"A lactating cow will consume every year almost six tons of forage dry matter, over 100 bushels of corn, 1,400 pounds of protein supplement, and 225 pounds of mineral/salt. You do the math.
We could eliminate world hunger if, instead of concentrating all that food into meat, we fed it directly to starving people."
- See previous... the food to feed the hungry is all over the place. The means to get it to those people does not. By the by, a lot of the grain fed to cattle is not grain humans can consume. There are many different types of corn. We're not the five-stomached cows you are vilifying.
4) "If huge amounts of protein were the key to perfect health, America would be the healthiest nation on earth because we eat a lot more meat than people in most other countries."
- Did you do any research into this? You only focus on protein consumption but leave out all the fats that are the true issue. Reduce fat consumption and you gain less weight. If protein alone causes obesity I challenge to only drink protein drinks morning, noon and night. Let's see how much weight you gain!
"Just in terms of common sense, look at a horse. It eats grass and hay and is extremely muscular and fast. We like to say, 'eat around the animal.'"
- I'd like to point out that I've never seen a skinny horse that wasn't malnourished and likewise for cattle or pretty much ANY animal on a strictly vegetarian diet. On the other end, it's rare you see a fat lion, cheetah, or other meat eater.
5) True, you can find something new by going outside of your comfort zone. Doesn't mean you have to give up meat!
In the end, you've failed to provide any sort of convinving arguement by making invalid or overly general claims. If you're going to argue for your cause, have specific points.
1 – I see your point and it isn't really a fair framing.
2 – haha! Pffft! Guilty as charged.
3 – "The catchall" Go ahead eat your meat in peace. Many more crops do go into food animals than directly into humans. Uh, cows are not made to eat corn (http://www.news.cornell.edu/chronicle/98/9.17.98/cattle_feeding.html), it causes an increase in E. Coli production. When they eat grass, as they are supposed to, they actually have more Omega-3 in their flesh, so we could stop eating so many fishes, but that's a side issue. Show me a spinach with E. Coli contamination and I'll show you a corn-fed cow farm just up the road with a river of waste contaminating the water supply. And once again that you are overlooking, as many omnis do, the fact that somewhere between 8-16 pounds of plant protein goes into a vegetarian animal to get ONE pound of protein (flesh) out. This obviously uses way more plants/chopped up field mice/pesticides/phosphates than if you were just to absolutely stuff yourself with vegetation each day. And maybe destroys more Salton Seas too.
4) I point to the book: The China Study. It talks specifically about animal protein, especially in diary that contributes to disease, including cancer. Wanna see a fat lion? Youtube "fat lion at the zoo". Hmm, maybe the issue is a little more complex?
5) Agreed, you're not convinced.
If God wanted me to eat vegetables, he wouldn't have made me out of meat.
What this author fails to mention is cost of producing vegetables. She fails to mention the vast dead zones in the Gulf of Mexico (prior to the oil spill) and the Chesapeake Bay that are directly a result of the fertilyzers that the farmers use to pruduce sucessful crop yields and the pesticides that are used to prevent crop loss to pests. Also the cost of shipping the vegetables from the location that they are grown to the location that they are sold. Does she think that the people who live in the cities of the north have developed a magical way to grow vegetables during the snow and in the winter. I challenge her to eat only locally grown, seasonally available native food and see if she remains healthy. The vast network of transportation used to ship crops are slowly causing just as much global warming as the tasty, tasty animals. As for the condition of the animals being used to feed us as long as the 'farm' is keeping up with the current required standards of care I have no problem with them being treated like the future food that they are and not the family farm pet that she thinks they should be treated like. Also according to the author its the eating of meat that is causing obesity in America and not the vast amounts of cupcakes, twinkies, soda pop and other junk food that a majority of people eat on a regular basis. So good news people you can eat all the twinkies you want and not get fat as long as you are a vegetarian. As for your morons that are up in arms about our removal from where our meat comes from and sentient life of plants vs animals . . . I have seen meat packing plants, and butchers. I can and will kill, butcher and eat my own meat if necessary and not be bothered but I see no reason to when we have so many folks willing to do it for me and put it into and nice clean little package for me to buy . . . also sentient or not we all share the same energy and are tied into the same web. Without the sentient beings to eat and disburse the seeds the plants would die and without the plants we would all die so to be honest I equate killing a baby cow for its TASTY TASTY veal on the same level of a carrot being pulled from the ground. Either way you are killing the life energy of a living thing. After all this talk I think I might go grill up some veal and bacon. Your vegetarians can enjoy munching on your rotting plant matter.
The thing vegetarians can't seem to understand is that Americans are over consuming meat – BECAUSE IT TASTES SO DAMN GOOD! And that is why you will NEVER convince the majority of people to stop eating meat.
Jazzpianist, good point. It works for me.
Hey Plants have feelings too. How would you like to be eaten alive. I can hear the screams coming from every salad bowl.
Since there seems to be such a ridiculous number of arguments being used by the veggie camp based on incomplete science, I'll try to straighten things out a bit. Here are some points I've seen made in previous comments, and a breakdown of how truthful they are:
1. Fiber is good for you. This is true. But why is it good for you? Because you CANNOT digest it, it is able to reach your colon and promote healthy bowel movements, etc. Therefore the argument that we are evolutionarily designed to be herbivorous is clearly false. Mammals that are evolved to survive on plant matter only generally fall into the category of ruminants, which humans are NOT.
2. Vegetarians/Vegans are more evolved. Entirely false. The reason people have a preference for fatty foods (sales of fast food are more than enough proof that people do indeed generally hold this preference ) is entirely evolutionary. When food was scarce in the time of our ancestors, natural selection had a much stronger impact on the gene pool than it does today (technology and modern medicine have negated many selective pressures on the human race). People today hold the preference for fatty foods because the early humans with the highest degree of evolutionary fitness (for the non-scientists out there, this essentially boils down to an individual's ability to produce viable offspring relative to other members of its population) were those who were genetically predisposed to like the taste of fat, which is much more energy-dense (more calories per gram) than carbohydrates or proteins. Those individuals who sought out foods with high lipid content (this would have been primarily meat or seeds/nuts) obtained more energy from their food and were more likely to survive and pass on their genes. Since the ultimate effect of evolution is to improve a species' ability to survive, we can therefore rule out evolution as a source of vegetarianism. In fact, vegetarianism is a luxury made possible by the artificially high availability of energy-rich vegetables such as corn, beans, and potatoes that has been created by modern agriculture.
3. Factory farming is bad. I actually agree entirely with this one. However many of those in the veggie camp fail to note (most likely from an understandable lack of experience based on their dietary choice) that the most flavorful and most sought after meats are those that come from much better living conditions. The most expensive beef (Kobe) comes from cows who lead lives better than most humans get to enjoy (massages every day? yes please!). To express my personal opinion as a meat-lover, I would be perfectly happy to eat less meat, if that meat were of a higher quality, and I am sure many others would agree with me.
4. Children are brainwashed into liking meat, etc. To be honest, I don't even understand how someone could arrive at this conclusion. How much more to we hear "Eat your veggies" as children than "Eat your meat?" Much more. This goes back to the evolutionary preference for energy-dense foods.
5. "Rotting carcass" and other usage of creative adjectives. This is a very transparent attempt to make meat sound unappetizing. Nobody who isn't on the brink of starvation (I refer to American society, I am aware that some cultures do have dishes in which meat is intentionally rotted) would willingly eat rotting meat. All food, and indeed all biological matter is decaying at some rate, but we find rotting meat no more appetizing than a rotting tomato in the garden. In both meat and vegetables, the fresher the better.
6. You should feel guilt about eating an animal. This is FALSE, guilt is entirely based on your own moral code. Personally, I feel guilty about leaving a steak uneaten.
7. Meat is bad for the planet. Okay, maybe it is. Then again, pretty much everything that modern society does is bad for the planet. Phosphate runoff from fertilizer causes dead-zones in the ocean, so vegetables don't get a free pass here either.
8. Someone tried to say that AIDS was a result of eating monkeys infected with SIV (Simian Immunodeficiency Virus, the progenitor to HIV). This is highly unlikely, as the necessary cellular receptors for HIV cellular entry are not found in the digestive tract. Getting the SIV/HIV virus from ingestion of bodily fluids would require an open passage to the bloodstream within the digestive tract. While this is possible via ulcers, it is far more likely that the transmission would initially occur via an open wound on the hunter's skin coming into contact with infected monkey blood.
9. Meat makes you fat. No, not eating a reasonably balanced diet and not exercising at all makes you fat. Don't blame the meat.
10. You're ignorant because you eat meat/I'm better than you because I do not. The funny thing about ignorance is that we're all programmed to think that those who don't agree with us are ignorant and/or idiots. If you don't believe me, go read the comments in any article about politics. That being said, no, I do not believe that I am ignorant, or that you are smarter than me. I'm a cancer research scientist, what are you?
Were you impressed when you read that last sentence? Of course not! Nobody is ever impressed by talk on the internet, and nobody ever will be! The bottom line is, nobody's opinion is going to change because of your comment, and I have no expectation that my comment will convert any vegetarians. I just hope that people will stop using incomplete science and half-truths to preach vegetarianism. If you've decided not to eat meat, I respect your decision, but its a personal choice, nothing more. Don't try to convince anyone else otherwise.
I'm a vegan and I don't want to eat animal products, and other than any bent toward eating meat, I mostly agree with your comments. Especially the ones that point out the holier-than-thou arguments. I dislike them too. I will point out, once again though, that you are overlooking, as many omnis do, the fact that somewhere between 8-16 pounds of plant protein goes into a vegetarian animal to get ONE pound of protein (flesh) out. This obviously uses way more plants/chopped up field mice/pesticides/phosphates than if you were just to absolutely stuff yourself with vegetation each day.
Glad to get a well thought out response. I am aware that a tremendous amount of plant matter goes into each cow, however if I am to compare the enjoyment that I would gain from eating the equivalent amounts of food, the meat comes out on top for me. In terms of pure efficiency, the plants would certainly be superior, but I have no inclination to pretend that I'm not primarily concerned with enjoying my food. I consider myself to be very fortunate to live in the first society in history to actually be able to eat itself to death, and am aware that it is certainly a luxury to be able to choose more meat. In response to the point about phosphates, I would contend that whether the plants are eaten by the cow or by me directly, the same amount of fertilizer will be used. Pesticides are definitely a problem since they are amplified in concentration as you move up the food chain, and though I'd prefer not to ingest too many chemicals, I'm pretty sure that ship has sailed long ago :( And with regards to chopped up field mice....to be honest I would probably be willing to eat a mouse if I was allowed to prepare it properly, I'm pretty adventurous with foods.
Also, I'm not trying to argue that somebody SHOULD eat meat, I'm just trying to point out some arguments that really aren't valid to use against meat consumption. I respect those who can do/are willing to do something that I won't do myself, and vegetarianism/veganism falls into that category. Only the holier-than-thou types that you mentioned lose that respect in my eyes.
I agree also it's nice to see someone thinking and not just slinging names. What's not to respect? :)
Also I couldn't help but notice your comment below about E. coli. While I'm not familiar with that specific study, I would note that E. coli is actually not a harmful bacterium and occurs naturally in the human digestive tract. E. coli becomes dangerous when it acquires a specific set of genes (called a pathogenicity island) that allow it to create toxins, resulting in the dangerous strains ie. O157:H7. Those virulence genes won't come into being on their own (thankfully), so there has to be a pre-existing source in the bacterial population. Expressing those genes actually decreases the fitness of E. coli, since it is actually in the bacterium's best interest that its host stays alive. That being said, I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that more E. coli necessarily means that they are the harmful strains. However, I have admittedly not read the results of that study in regards to the composition of the bacterial population, so you may be right. I simply warn against reading too much into any scientific result that isn't extremely specific.
Couldn't help but go look over the article, I hadn't considered acid-resistance, which certainly strengthens your point.
I really don't care if people are vegitarians, I don't care if they are Vegan, I do care when they believe animals have more rights than humans. God gave us dominion over the rest and as such we should exercise good judgement of management and husbandry and keep the creatures in good health so we can harvest them accordingly.
I don't agree with you, but I know we will agree to disagree at best. I would just like to point out something that we _might_ agree on: factory farming is not equal to "good judgment of management and husbandry". We don't keep the creatures in good health as more and more farming becomes corporate. They are very cruel conditions, actually. Family farms may be considered humane; they at least were just as hard on the humans running them as they were on the animals. ;) But things are different in corporate farming, which is most farming in this country today.
This discussion is hilarious, its amazing how heated people get as they get defensive and start pointing fingers at each other. I am actually a vegetarian, but not for any moral/political reasons, just because over time my taste buds simply changed and I don't enjoy meat/chicken or seafood anymore, mostly its texture kinda grosses me out. Well a lot of people get grossed out by many things others eat, like tofu still kinda grosses me out, so let it be. But I also know that if everybody ate as much meat as the average american, we could not provide for even half of the planet's population. So I guess someone has to make sacrifices. Fine with me. The bottom line is, even my science books tell me that a vegetarian diet is more efficient that a carnivore diet. When you eat a cow, for instance, you have to digest the cow itself first in order to digest the things it ate, like grass, or any other plants animals eat! So eating those plants directly simply saves you energy on your metabolism, you don't have to digest extra. That being said, I'm not a hater on meat. I have plenty of friends that eat steak, bacon, pork and what not, and when I go out to dinner with them I don't preach to them. I also don't preach to people smoking cigarettes although they are essentially killing themselves, hey I used to be one of those idiots. It's your life, do/eat/smoke what you wish. Just because you're a vegetarian doesn't mean you eat healthy – hello french fries!! Or alcoholic beverages for that matter. Just remember that what you put in your body is more important than you might think. Everything in moderation, preferably with the best quality you can afford. You wouldn't be putting shitty 87 oil in your brand new Infinity, so treat your body right! You are what you eat!!!
The human body is not designed for a vegetable only diet. Like it or not, we are carnivores, period...
It's so stupid when vegetarians refer to eating meat as eating "rotting carcasses". I hear this all the time from them. The steak on my dinner plate is not rotting meat. People who say that are being highly over dramatic.
Also the comment Jane made about children naturally shunning the taste of meat is COMPLETE B.S.!!! She totally made that crap up.
this just reminded me that quail season starts here in Arizona today. i'm gonna fill my freezer with tasty birds later on this morning.
I eat lots of vegetables because I grow them. Nothing is more satisfactory than zucchini and squash sauteed in garlic and olive oil, brown rice, a salad and nice steak or fresh fish. I wish I lived on property zoned for livestock. I'd "grow" them too.
I agree with her. .It is OK to eat some meat. But the focus on a full meat diet stresses not only your body, but the environment as well. How many people really need so much meat and so much muscle? Most of the time, all the protein ends up in the wrong places and stresses the body. Also, just going by taste and salivation is just being an animal. Where is your intellect that makes you human? Horses and cows have more intellect.
Don't you feel like there is a dead person on your plate and you are eating him/her.
A lot of crazy people posting here, I feel sorry for you all.
Look into a mirror and feel sorry for who you see there, you condescending person.
Mario,
One of the results of the advancing economies in the East is an increased consumption of meat. Guess their healthy diets were not entirely voluntary. Also on the icrease are all the illnesses that seem to come with it. But then again those illness might also be attributable to having more time to spend in front of HD TV. I agree that it is unfortunate that CNN chose this particular person to state the case for being vegetarian. But moderate opinions seldom get much press.
Yes, adult onset diabetes is on the rise in China as the western diet and lifestyle moves in. I read 90 MILLION diabetics in China. Hard to believe, isn't it? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8587032.stm
It's too bad that they aren't putting Sodium Floride in their water. I heard that that can reverse the effects of diabetes if you drink enough of it. My dentist told me that (sarcastic)
I do often wonder if vegetarians think about all the small animals that are ground up and squashed by cultivation equipment as their vegetables are processed.
But we don't wonder whether you think about how many more rodents get ground up feeding the enormous quantities of vegetation your vegetarian meat animals consume. We know you don't!
Perhaps. However, I firmly believe that if there is one thing that humankind has done to truly hurt this planet and ourselves, it was to invent farming and cultivation. Since civilization is now so firmly based on it, I doubt anything can be done about it, but I don't think most vegetarians realize the true negative impact that agriculture had and still has on our planet. I actually feel guilty eating ANY food humans mass-produce for that reason. I still eat it, I guess I'm a hypocrite, but if everything is bad I guess I might as well enjoy what i eat.
Well, we must eat (and contribute to global warming using these huge data centers) in order to post our world-changing views on eatocracy. :) So take heart Shayl and do your best.
CNN, your trusted source for FAIR and BALANCED news.
/sarcasm
Meat is important to be healthy, look healthy, and be vibrant. Especially for body builders and athletes. Notice in her picture she has some bad wrinkles and veins popping out of her hands begging for some real food.
Vegetarians and vegans are OK...but they should not preach it like it's some sort of evangelism. Get right with yourself first.
Nope! I will post this link again: http://veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bios. I don't know if you are old enough to remember Edwin Moses and Carl Lewis but they are just two world-class vegetarian/vegan athletes.
Matthew: In contrast to Amanda's lecture on the anthropological structure of the human race, I agree that there needs to be "a middle ground" . While not everyone is fortunate enough to own property on which they can hunt, there are livestock producers that raise animals in a very humane manner. Simply put, it's called "free range" where livestock is allowed to graze in open space or in large pens. While that should quiet those with cruelty concerns it won't address those with "ethics" concerns. Some of us just don't feel it is egregious to eat meat. Especially a rare steak.
My girlfriend is vegetarian and thank god that she's not like this woman. Velez-Mitchell gives vegans and vegetarians a bad name by being one of those arrogant, holier-than-thou activists.
You're not winning anyone to your side, lady.
Also, organic farming techniques would kill millions of people. The crop yield per acre is too low, there isn't enough arable land on Earth to feed everyone using organic techniques.
And I've also noticed that one of the surest ways to spot a fool who is speaking out of their hindquarters is if they use the word "sheople/sheeple". The only people I've ever heard use that word are loon-bag conspiracy theorists.
So if we can't support our population size with natural food, what is the next step in fixing this crisis?
We're already several steps into solutions. Modern farming techniques have allowed human population to escalate to incredible numbers. Farming techniques and specially bred crops (through selective crop breeding or genetic manipulation) are constantly being improved upon. The real challenge is getting these techniques and technologies to the nations that don't have them yet.
Half of us could move to that new planet we just found, lol! Or just find another one that sounds more feasible to get to...
Honestly, nature has only ever had one way of fixing overpopulation, and I don't like it much. We have our own fix, and I don't like it much, either.
There are just way too many of us right now. We need a few discoveries to happen and some breakthroughs in science/engineering...
I usually can spot the loon bags although I have never seen a loon nor a loon in a bag nor a bag for a loon. You are right "sheeple" is so politically incorrect. We should now officially refer to 'them' as "informationally challenged" or how about use the term "intellectually incapacitated." As for the conspiracy theorists most of those that I have met have been right on when the facts are laid on the table. For example, you would have to be a total loon bag to think that L.H. Oswald assassinated Kennedy by himself. Or how about those loon bags that used to think that there was a group called the bilderberg group. Oh thats right they were right on that time too. The bilderberg group actually 'came out of the closet' and now even have an official website. You must be referring to that group of architects and engineers with 25,000 years of combined building experience that claims to have proof that the world trade center was a controlled demolition. Now thats a crazy thought there. Real nutcases. Even though I have never built anything larger than a wooden deck for a patio – I with all my less than two days building experience and no civil engineering degree could possibly believe that the world trade center was a controlled demolition. It's a good thing that there isn't like some pillars in georgia that talk about reducing the world's population down to 500,000,000 from six billion. Cause then I would really have to give some credibility to a few of the conspiracy theories.
I thought the first response was pretty good, but as soon as she started using the same tired arguments I was lost. If only we knew the truth (about factory farms and the treatment of animals)? Is that really enough to make people go vegetarian? The really annoying thing about that argument is that I know about factory farms and the treatment of animals, the suffering they go through and the inhumane treatment at the slaughterhouse. But I still eat meat. This is where you lose the most people, missing the fact that there is apparently something else at play, and those of us who still eat meat just roll our eyes. My life partners are both vegan, but I eat meat. They avoid eating meat because they say the eating of meat makes them feel guilty, but they call me their meat-eater. My friend's wife eats vegetarian and will have sushi and no other meat, but she will still gladly prepare a big, thick steak for her partner.
There are no reasonable arguments for adopting veganism over being omnivorous; there are only appeals to human emotion.
Beans and oats do NOT give protein calories like meat. At best you can maintain a sub-sufficient mass to carry out daily life. Proof is in your demographic. Vegans are skinny, near emaciated, lethargic zombies. There's NO diet that can build muscle anywhere close to meat-eaters. You suffer deficiencies from iron, zinc, B12, calcium, vitamin D, long chain n-3 fatty acids (omega-3), iodine and others.
the horse argument is weak at best. horses are muscular because, well, they are horses and their physiology is quite different from ours.
So wrong. All nutrients humans need to thrive can be found in the non-animal kingdoms. I have posted sources of all the nutrients you list in the MD/PhD thread. If you want to see proof of veggie protein power, check this out: http://veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bios
Roger, you miss the point. Just because you CAN get the nutrients doesn't mean it's PRACTICAL from a clinician's standpoint. We can't get our patients to eat a balanced diet that includes meat, which is basically like a superfood in terms of the amount and array of essential nutrients it provides, how would you expect us to responsibly recommend vegetarian/veganism to those patients?
More power to you for your dedication and responsibility to a lifestyle, but recognize that it is your serious dedication which makes it possible, and no amount of pressuring by a doctor will ever instill that in the vast majority of patients.
Why don't you ask Dr. Dean Ornish how he does it? Or maybe Dr. Michael Greger?
wow, bravo Jane velez mitchell! i did not expect that. i woke up last week and read 5 reasons to not be a vegetarian and thought it was a joke. it was a waste of a post and i couldn't believe it was on the news. this hit it on nail, it's time for Sheople to wake up, it's time for a paradigm change. i have been an organic vegan for a year and half and cannot begin to tell you the amazing changes in my life. we have been brainwashed people, it's time for a change, it's time to evolve because if we are not evolving we are dying. wake up sheople, wake up.
I feel like the biggest issue that many vegetarians and vegans have about eating meat is eating factory-farmed meat (which is almost all of the meat that most of us eat). The conditions of the factory farms are horrible, for both the animals and the workers involved. If you care anything about animals then of course this is going to bother you and encourage you to eat a more vegetarian/vegan diet or to eat meat that doesn't come from a factory farm. Because these factory farms also have been proven to contribute more to pollution than any other sector, if you care about the environment at all then it seems reasonable that you might make this decision as well. But seeing as most of the authors of the comments I read on here have made it abundantly clear that they don't care about either of thes things...I encourage you to look at the workers, who are frequently injured, paid very little, and are also mistreated. If you care about human rights then it is hypocritcial to support factory farms. End of story. If you're still not convinced, because of the stress, malnutrition, and general sheer hell the animals are forced to endure, the quality of the meat is greatly diminished as far as taste and nutrition. Factory farms produce UNHEALTHY animals. If you feel comfortable putting them in your body, then by all means, please continue. But for these (and MANY other) reasons, people shouldn't support factory farms. That's why I'm a vegetarian, and why many other vegetarians/vegans decided to make the switch. People polarize this argument, and turn it into something much more black and white than it is. There are valid points for eating meat and for not eating meat, but we should all be able to agree that supporting factory farms is immoral and illogical, And is a valid reason to be a vegetarian or vegan.
Well said!
Ok, so reasons #1 through 3 she lists for being a vegetarian are because she feels guilty. Well, I don't. She whines about how a steak is just some animal's rotting carcass. That's great. Most of the plants we eat are the seeds. That's right folks, we eat plant fetuses. And those plants that we eat parts of other than the seed? It's still dead and rotting, just like the animal flesh. Further, with modern farming techniques, animals get killed as we harvest plants, too.
Every morality based reason for being a vegetarian is a personal choice. Some people feel it is immoral to keep animals as pets, should I turn my cat out, too?
As for health reasons, meat is part of a healthy diet. Yes, people do tend to overindulge (guilty). But it is no coincidence that many vegetarians are anemically thin and that many of them do not properly recover from injuries. The body needs nutrients found in meats that are not found in plants in practical quantity.
One of the things that boggles my mind is that vegetarians are always trying to find ways to make their food taste like meat. Really? Than why be a vegetarian at all? Eating meat is an instinct, not eating meat is a choice. No one is under any obligatin to make that choice. And making that choice does not make a vegetarian in any way superior to a non-vegetarian.
Why are you confused by the fact that many vegetarian foods try to emulate meat? Most vegetarians/vegans do so for moral reasons, not because they don't like the taste. And many of us grew up eating meat, so yes we are used to having that taste as part of our diet. Also, yes if vegetarians ate only plants then it would be hard to maintain a healthy diet. However, there are plenty of meat substitutes that provide plenty of protein. So if you throw in a mutlivitamin and some vegan omega-3 pills and you're all set.
Yes, animals are killed accidentally as part of harvesting techniques. Do vegetarians say we can save every animal on the planet? No. We are trying to lessen our impact. And your plant fetus comment is too ignorant to even address.
Ignorant, is it? Ok, smart-guy, what do seeds grow into? What does a human fetus grow into? Holy crap, look at that! It is no coincidence that many of the sexual and developmental terms used in science to describe animal and plant reproduction are the same. In the spring when you see tree polen accumulate all over the place? Guess what, that's tree semen! I'm dead serious, look it up.
I love animals....they're delicious!
Mario, I suppose you're right. I only liked meat smothered with salt and sauce. Guess I never really liked it to begin with. My humble suggest would be that everyone ought to give a vegetarian diet a try. You might find you were really just hooked on ketchup all those years.
The closest I have personally come to how you and other vegetarians eat was when I was in Korea for a while. I ate mostly at local restaurants. They eat a lot of vegetables in their diet, some meat, and very little carbs (it was usually in the form of a very small bowl of white rice, lol). I didn't like the taste at first, but my body felt a lot healthier.
After a few years, I reflected on that time again and decided to make it a normal thing to increase my vegetable and berry intake(learning about berries was another experience I learned about). I have experienced the value of a higher consumption of plant life, but the absence of meat from my diet has caused negative reaction in my body in the past.
People should have to do their own killing like in the old days. We would eat less meat and have more respect for animals and hunters.
Couldn't even finish reading her answer to the second question. I am an omnivore and I love both vegetables and certain types of meat. When someone uses terms like rotting carcass and unimaginable hell then they are arguing from the heart and not the head. They are trying to appeal to my amygdala and make me feel bad for treating animals cruelly. I loose all respect for people who look down on me and think I am a horrible person for my 2 pieces of bacon in the morning. I will listen to someone who will make arguments on the taste and the healthiness of vegetarianism vs. meat-eaters. But I will not entertain arguments from someone who thinks of me a a second class citizen. Chef Tim made the case I am talking about..."holier-than-thou types"....let us eat in peace. CNN...next time choose someone who brings intellectual debate to the table instead of someone who just puts down and rejects what the other person is saying. She did not once bring up the health benefits of being vegetarian. She only brought up the health benefits of NOT being a meat eater. Horrible argument.
"She did not once bring up the health benefits of being vegetarian. She only brought up the health benefits of NOT being a meat eater. Horrible argument." NOW THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT. Excellent point. I support better management of our meat production and the lifestyles of vegetarianism/vegan. However, you are the only one who brought out that problem in a way that is logical. I friggin' love you right now!
Logical thinking should survive...if that was only the case.
PS Love you too amanda! ;)
The Food Chain works by the predator eating prey within their element or environment. This is also known as survival of the fittest. The prey gets to spend their life as it was intended to be, not cooped up in cage under foul conditions that possibly in the near future will raise some flags and change how we massively handle meat. In all fairness, if we eat meat, the animal should be in their environment and trapped in a cage. This was the way the food chain was meant to work. Our great ancestors rapidly evolved into what we are today just by doing it the way the rest of the animal kingdom does it. Our species requires us to eat meat because we have yet to find a syndicated replacement that provides us with all the benefits meat gives us. I fear the worst if we continue treating animals this way and eating garbage meat from mass production. For now I eat vegetables and meat that is 100% from it's element (hunting).
sorry, I meant in their element and not trapped in a cage.
See reason #3.
Neither are very convincing arguments. They both come across a little... fringe. Besides, what happened to a balanced diet? They both act like its all or nothing. Humans evolved to eat all kinds of things, including meat and vegetables. IMO, there's nothing like a Steak with a side of Broccoli and rice preceded by a fresh salad.
Excellent points Amanda. Well said.
Matthew, is it about fairness? I don't believe so. It's about equal choice. I won't get on the bandwagon about what choices animals have regardless of how they are killed. My husband is a hunter although he has not hunted since we met. I never asked him to stop nor did I judge him for hunting. I believe it's mostly as Jen stated, it's mostly about disconnection and it sounds as if you are connected Matthew, you are considering your choices. I have a dear friend who hunted for 50 years. One day he looked through the scope of his gun at the buck he was intending to shoot and could not pull the trigger. He put down his gun and never hunted again. He is a natural photographer ~ all the years of observing wildlife in their natural habitat. He told me he's never been happier shooting animals that with his camera. It's a story I've never forgotten.
Beautiful :).
What a beautiful bedtime story.
I quit eating meat after reading a book by Anthony Robbins. After a short time of staying off the stuff I came to realize that it smells of bile and rotting flesh. That's why they have to put all that sauce all over it to make it bearable to eat. I still go to steak houses when social events require it. I just eat the salad. I don't tell anyone else what they should eat, or why I don't want to eat it. It's a bit of leap to become a vegetarian, but once you've crossed over to the light your simply don't want to go back. And to keep myself honest I eat a bit of bacon now and then.
Hmmm..... I've never put any sauce on my steak, other then to try and see why others did. Usually having to put sauce on a steak is a sign of poor cooking. I have seen American's other then myself put sauce on meats, but I never understood it fully. It always came out too sweet or too salty for me. It ruined the taste. As far as meat smelling bile, maybe the meat really was old. There is a certain science that comes with picking meat out, including poking, looking for color, and of course, smelling. If it smells bad, it probably is bad.
It smells like bile? It's all in your head. The vegetarian argument is typically psychological, as much the strictly carnivorous attitude is usually dumb and ill-informed. In my book, all food that is delicious to ME, vegetable and animal is, by default, delicious, and as such, the way for me to go.
One man's 'bile' is another man's olfactory nirvana. What does bile even smell like anyway? If it smells like a medium seared ribeye, I guess I'll blow the froth off a fresh mug of bile to go with my next meal. LOL.
Hunter gathers did a lot more gathering than hunting (or catching i should say). They didn't feel bad for the animals, but they probably respected them a lot more. The meat industry is not instinct. The real irony is that I am driving to five guys as I text this ;)
What. the. hell. I was hoping to get some insight from this article about why a vegetarian diet would be more healthy, and instead I am confronted by some fanatic's idea of morals.
I suppose lions are going to hell for eating gazelles. Some bozo in here said that all animals are equal, including humans!!! Well then why is it ok for a snake to eat a mouse, but I can't have a burger!?!
Ridiculous. Have a factual argument and I'll start listening.
I understand your frustration, but she never said you can not eat a burger- she said it's bad for the planet, unsustainable for the population, and ultimately bad for you that 6 billion burgers get eaten. Make a little more sense? On the side, you should check out the "vegetarians taste better" campaign. ;)
Ok, how about the fact that we are far more intelligent and capable of reasoning (moral, logical, etc) than other animals such as the snake and lion you mention, which act primarily based on instinct. They need to do that to survive. What's your excuse? Are you claiming to be as enslaved by your historic primal urges as one of these animals? You have the ability to think about your options and to choose to consume vegetarian food rather than killing an animal for a cheeseburger. Yet you voluntarily choose to still eat the burger assumably because you like the taste. This is specifically what incriminates consumption of meat by humans over consumption of meat by "lower" animals.
Im not going for the big arguments concerning what is more precious (animals or cognitive animals), etc. What I am saying is that to kill an animal for food is not bad. It is a part of our genome to do so for survival in certain regions for adaptation purposes. Northern, marginalized cultures still eat primarily nothing but seals that they personally kill as frequently as necessary to survive in that climate. However, I live in an industrialized, first world country. I have a choice to run for a burger, or take the time to eat in a way that demands higher levels of quality as opposed to brutal quantity. I think that is a thing to be supported more often. I don't have a problem with a family buying free range cattle meat from the market with zero hormones because it will last them a week by freezing and thawing proportions– I'm saying we are not capable of continuing the demand for fast food, filler garbage. It's not good for us to eat, and it's not necessary for us as a culture to promote anymore- even if you really want to.
I am going to try to find a middle ground here. The way that animals are treated and kept in these “farming” facilities is quite horrendous so I see why people would have a problem with it. In most cases however, these same people have a problem with hunting to obtain meat which is totally different. My family and I have only eaten the meat that we have harvested with our own hands by hunting animals on my families land. I do not find this cruel in the least, and I think it is fair to say that killing a free animal for food is not cruel. I am highly interested what others may think though. Is this type of meat eating practice fair to the vegetarian community? I do not completely abstain from eating meat, but I am getting it from sources that are not condemning animals to torture and disease. Please comment, I would love to see your opinions.
I'm on a strange side of things because I am not a vegetarian. I simply try, consistently, to buy only from producers that ensure the free-range, organic diet and non-hormonal treatment of their animals. I do this because I think it is much healthier for me, and I think the more people invest in these specific farmer's/stores the greater the demand for others to change their practices. As for hunting, I don't have a problem with it- but I'm not necessarily a huge livestock advocate in the first place. If you are not overkilling the nearby herds or going after the most likely to continue the vitality of the group, I have zero problem with hunting your own food. Deer and moose steaks are amazing!!!
Ive been reading your posts. Keep up the good work!
In my college anthropology class, we actually spoke extensively about food-getting techniques in different cultures as it is one of the most basic universal needs all humans have and can relate to on some level. Apparently, we have only been a species of non-foragers for approximately 10,000 years. That is not a long time to adjust, for us or the planet. Due to the extreme upswing in demand for processed food stocked in our fridge as opposed to a daily calorie intake/cooperative and community oriented way of life, the collective human race has ultimately gone against its natural needs and appropriate population. Meat was only supposed to account for about 30% of our diet, the rest is meant to be (in most regions of the world) either fish or flora. The fact that we have become so defensive and ultimately addicted so quickly to maintaining the meat industry only means it will get worse. It is an individual choice, but the way demand is going (up and only up), you may do well to adapt before the curve forces you to acculturate and take the loss in a way that hurts later.
An abstract concept such as morality should not be placed in front or interfere with instinct. Lets go back a step to when we humans were hunters and gatherers, I bet we felt really bad for killing all those animals to survive, not.
As time has led to this moment, we humans have the ability to reflect on what we perceive, something that separates man from every other animal. We know that we are going to die some day, an animal doesn't know death until it comes.
Like someone said before, a plant is also a living being. It may not have consciousness or the ability to perceive but it would be a hypocrite of you to call out animal cruelty and not plant cruelty as well.
The woman that posted those 5 reasons can only be called ignorant. Firstly because she doesn't see the 'bigger picture', she lacks perspective on something that cannot simply be attributed to morality, but political systems as whole, an accelerating population, and the fact that she blames meat as the ultimate reason as to why people are so fat in the US.
After reading this I'm in the mood from some flamenons
Jane Velez-Mitchell is on several ridiculous crusades because CNN has given her a pulpit. What difference does it make what one eats and processes through the body? Humane treatment of livestock should always be the goal and is, in my opinion, the only value the article contains. In addition to her seemingly endless rants about animals, she's on a men hating crusade with her "war on women" spew. I am so nauseated by her continuous blame of men whenever there is a crime where the victim is a woman. Is it a coincident that she's a recently avowed lesbian? I don't watch her show any more; I'm sick of being attacked because of my gender.
I am confused as to how the commentator's gender, sexual preference, or other opinions are directly associated with her concerns specifically about the meat industry and subsequent lifestyles that do not believe it is affordable or healthy to maintain. I agree that she is a forceful writer, but she was asked to commentate due to CNN's overwhelming response from her side of the discussion. She did not demand to push any doctrine down someone's throat.
It is curious to see the venom and defensiveness in the comments . . . . . quite the study in humanity . . . like I said, it is an emotional subject. And Jen says it best when she states that "we are so disconnected from our food . . .". I am truly grateful to live in a country we have so much choice. I have made a choice to eat vegan. It's really just that simple for me. Why are we all not celebrating the fact that we are blessed with the freedom to choose????
No kidding... its one more example of the problems we face right now. Someone gives a second opinion about how our culture needs to move beyond this pubescent stage and suddenly everyone's rights are in danger? You just can't have a civil argument anymore without "don't tread on me" completely destroying every opportunity for advancement. My generation (about 25 y/o) need to be held accountable to how this type of situation is getting completely away from us. Don't blame the generation that gave us these problems, blame the guys who don't want us to do ANYTHING ABOUT THEM lol
I wish i could eat meat, sometimes
but i'm restricted health wise to a diet , i try to makethe best i can, oils and sugars ect are tough on my system.
very
but i remember.. gotta enjoy life and there are great substitutes,
music is love
love is god
pitta bread
Who is this Dick Love guy anyway? Is he always a condescending jackass? He reminds me of smokers who ran around blowing carcinogenic smoke in babies faces and telling them to toughen up. I don't care if you eat meat or vegetables, but whatever you do, please don't be a baby seal-beating smarmtool like Dick Love. This guy is the ugliest thing in the whole article.
I LOVED MEAT, but now I'm a vegan because I want to be healthier and live a cruelty free lifestyle. Here's a challenge:
Read the book "Skinny Bitch", and go without eating meat for 30 days. See if you feel better both mentally and physically. After 30 days, go back to eating meat if you like. What's 30 days away from your normal habits going to cost you? Not preaching. Sharing is caring.
Holy molly I feel absolutely no guilt in eating an animal. So thats not a problem for me. Ah meat is good for you provides you with protein needed to help growing minds etc. Your parents ate meat and so did your ancestors. Your only surviving if you go without meat. I'm going to go on until the day I die eating what I enjoy.
In our society today, as in all things, it is about money. No matter where one stands on an issue, the bottom line is always money. Money allows people to survive.
The main reason for the obesity epidemic in our country isn't from eating meat but from over consumption of calories in general, mainly from sugar and "high fructose corn syrup". Soda and liquid sugar are easily digestible and get converted to fat much more easily.
Jane sure out intellctualized Tim. From presidents to chefs, are all people from Texas numbnuts'? Appreciate what you had to say Jane. I've been trying the vegan route, haven't mastered it yet but I'm remaining conscious of animal products in my food.
Indeed she did! I'm still almost baffled by Tim's embarrassing attempt to argue against vegetarianism. Anyway... also considering veganism myself. I suppose I'm basically vegan in practice, but I will consume the occasional dairy product when eating out. Best of luck to you.
"Are all people from Texas numbnuts?" Yes, we are. That is all.
Are all people from california homosexuals? Didnt think so. Lets think before we speak next time. Thanks and Gig Em
I'm from California and I'm a Homosexual
Let's get real here. I am by no meas a vegetarian or commie, though I may be accused of being one after this post. When a vegetarian starts to preach to me, I naturally get defensive about my choice to eat meat. But this isn't simply about eating meat. It is about where our meat comes from. Most people who eat meat probably spend 25-50 seconds a year pondering why we have so much cheap meat that is so readily available (you can purchase a double cheese burger for a dollar without getting out of your car). Some people might have some notion of a family farm of hard working Americans putting steak on our table. Those people are thinking of meat production from the 60 years ago. It is 2010. The industry has been walmartized. I see 12 year olds who look like 16 year olds and I wonder. Probably living off the dollar menu at your local meat/grease shack. Something just doesn't seem natural to me. I don't blame other countries for banning our 'roided up meat (they do). As for the bravado and feeling of manliness wrapped up with eating steak, that was probably formulated by the same people who, ten years ago, convinced us it was every God-fearing Americans' right to own a two-ton SUV. I am not saying don't eat meat, but don't be blind to what's going on because you feel threatened either. I admit there is the matter of cost. Free range, humanely raised, meat may cost a little more, but then again we could stand to eat a little less of it anyway. I taste the difference in the meat I buy at whole foods, compared to the shit they sell at the discount grocery store(savers, stop&shop).
Eating meat is an ENTIRELY separate issue from factory farming. I disagree with the horrendous conditions in most factory farms, but that is not to say eating meat is wrong. There are many humane ways to produce meat (take Chipotle's chicken, for example). Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater!
Her counterpoints were a bit ridiculous. If she is pro-life, then she wouldn't be eating plants, either. Plants are living things just the same as animals. If she wants the purest for of energy, she should lay out in the sun and try to evolve photovoltaic cells.
In reality, we are omnivores. We have been omnivores throughout time. Our bodies have adapted to this lifestyle and evolved this way. That being said, the environments our farm animals are living in are atrocious. I would wish that on anyone except Bin Laden and pals. There does need to be a revamp on how these animals are prepared for consumption. Just because maggots are nutritious, doesn't mean I'm going to eat one because it lives in an atrocious environment. That same mentality needs to be applied to our farm animal raising. Don't raise animals in shit for me to eat.
I am a meat eater, but I do know the pluses to both sides. I am a realist. I believe in a happy medium and eat lots of vegetables(and as many berries as I can) in my diet as well. There are other, greater factors to our obesity in America.
One of these things is HOW OFTEN you eat. The human body is designed to eat more often then the 3 meals a day. Smaller portions eaten throughout the day is the healthiest way to eat. As far as diet goes, carbs are overrated. We need much less of those, and more vegetables and fruits(especially berries). Eat bread with more grains in it(9 grain, 12 grain). Things like this.
Health cannot be solved by some all exclusive rule. You then ignore other aspects of what makes us human. We also can't forget that we are human and as such, better then treating farm animals in the way we presently do.
"If she is pro-life, then she wouldn't be eating plants, either. Plants are living things just the same as animals."
I'm never quite sure if people are serious when they try to use this argument against vegetarians. You do realize that plants have no nervous system, and thus are not capable of physical or emotional suffering or having desires like the will to live, like we humans do..?
And the "natural omnivore" argument really doesn't fly. I don't give a darn if we evolved by raping and pillaging each other and other species, or if we evolved as gargantuan space-fearing beasts that devoured worlds, if we can survive perfectly healthily while reducing the harm we do to others, then how can not and just go around saying "meh, this is just what we do". We must use our brains and evolve.
Unfortunately for your argument, a nervous system has no bearing on whether something is alive or not. Believe it or not, there are ways of killing things to where they are dead before they feel pain. For example, the proper way to kill a pig is to knock it unconscious first. If you don't do that first step, you contaminate the meat. Whoa... nature has a humane way to eat animals?
Unfortunately, the natural omnivore argument does hold weight because we have EVOLVED by the use of those nutrients. We don't rape and pillage to lead a healthy lifestyle because it has nothing to do with the fuel for our bodies. We do need to eat healthy, though. That means eating our foods in their most natural state, both plant and animal. Think of it in the sense of Yin and Yang. Through balance in diet, we can lead healthier lives.
Every baby born craves dairy.
I think factory farms are deplorable. Yet, I still do enjoy eating meat, eggs and dairy products. But I also choose organic products and I don't eat meat at every meal.
I am lucky to live in a state where organic produce and other products is readily accessible. This is a problem.
Everyone has a right to eat healthy food that doesn't poison our farmers, poison us (due to chemicals, and the factory conditions that cause contamination), and harm the environment (everything that goes into the water, comes back to use somehow).
I hope that one day people will reliable that our current standards are not sustainable in the long run. We are so disconnected from our food, it's actually sad. Organic food/choice is not about hippy values and environmentalists. It's about health, quality and respecting our food and ourselves.
It's interesting to read people's responses as I've been at both sides of the spectrum and my family falls across the meat vs veggie continuum. In some respect, I agree with people who want (and have) the freedom to eat meat, and the other half of me is torn for the US to make one big experiment and try to eat meat only once a week...just to see what happens. I'll never be a bleeding heart vegan or a card caring NRA member, but I would encourage people to just try being vegetarian (outside of your yearly cleanse diet) and record how you react to it. I managed to do it for 7 years, and while I'm back to eating a very limited amount of meat, it changes your perspective on one's own eating habits.
All that said, there are a lot of silly arguments on both sides of the equation, but I would encourage both sides to try to be a little vulnerable and try to hear each other out.
I think both sides represented themselves very poorly. As far as not eating meat for a week, if I don't eat meat for too long, I start getting heart palpitations and anxiety. I also get that feeling you get when you're teething. I'm not sure how long it takes because I've never done it consciously, but I imagine it starts happening after 2 or 3 days. For some reason, eating things like cold cuts in sandwiches(except for roast beef) doesn't really help. When I get like that, it's really only beef that I get the craving for. On another note, If I don't eat vegetables and fruits often enough, I have severe drops in energy. I literally lay down wherever I'm at and take a nap. It almost always lasts 2 to 2.5 hours.
I should probably see a doctor for all these things, lol. Maybe something's wrong with me. Haha
ha, i was praying she had a few Real reasons just to spark my thoughts. 'I get quite sad when i smell bacon lol' lol
I hear that sperm count is way lower in vegans :)
Ahhhh! That's right! It's because vegans are mostly gay or lesbians. Wait! shouldn't the sperm count should be way higher in the gay vegans than the lesbian ones right?
Glad to see you're making such good use of your time here.
Everybody knows Neanderthals were mostly vegetarians and everybody knows Neanderthals aren't around anymore! I Thinks Homosapiens ATE Neanderthals!!!!!! so only time will tell if vegans become extinct, but then again you'd have to believe in evolution and that's another story.
we are living longer than ever as human beings, and we are still eating meat from every other species on this planet, something must be working, right?
Now you got directly to the crux of their issue – "People are bad – Animals are good – Get rid of the People"
Does it still count as being a vegan if the people who make your clothes, build your house, fix/make your car and grow your food eat cute animals? Labor is part of the process.
This is an emotional subject for people (as evidenced by the comments). I appreciate the intelligent debate between Jane and Tim, thank you both. As for the responses . . . most are embarrassingly apathetic . . . at best.
I am vegan and have been for the past 5 years. Before that I was vegetarian for most of my adult life. It's a choice I came to first morally, and then because of my desire for peak health. We are a fat, sick, and emotionally crippled society and it's because of what we put into our mouths. The average American diet consists of very little 'real' food. We refuse to eat whole foods but we will shoot ourselves up with Botox and drink ourselves stupid and then run to the doctor and act all confused when he tells us our arteries are clogged and our liver is toast. I have little hope that we will make intelligent, humane choices about our food and our consumerism before we destroy ourselves completely. It's frightening to think of how rapidly our overall health is declining. We are like, spoiled, undisciplined children that will hurl ourselves to the ground and throw a tantrum if we can't have what we want even though it's bad for us (killing us!). We're not hopeless but we're headed in that direction fast . . . We need to educate ourselves or stay ignorant and die.
"We are a fat, sick, and emotionally crippled society and it's because of what we put into our mouths."
Here we go again – "We're going to tell the government to tell you what's good for you because we know better than you do about what's healthy"
I will give you some credit though – At least you are not apathetic – How does Pathetic sound!
OBTW – You can tell me what to eat as as you can pry my cold dead fingers from the trigger of my assault rifle
ur fcn duuuuum wayn holy craaaaap
Amen
You keep saying "WE", but you are not a part of that category. You mean to say "Ya'll" or "You people" or "Yoose guys". You are no destroying yourself. You are not undisciplined. You are not making bad choices when it comes to food. You are healthy, vibrant, intelligent, an adult, unspoiled, disciplined, and full of hope and will never be hopeless. I'm certain you mean people who eat meat, sugar, and fast food, not you.
First of all, she makes alot more good points than Tim Love, and, I am a meat eater. No doubt some of this type of treatment to animals is hidden from us (the consumer). In eating meat, there is no right and no wrong.....its simply a choice that everyone has a right to make and she is just bringing issues to the table that everyday people don't think about. A good, healthy choice would be to greatly reduce your meat consumption and I'm going to try that myself....so....thank you Jane!
I understand why people would eat meat...tastes like heaven. I just can't wrap my head around the killing machines. So cold...........
That's because it's better warm. Try tossing it on the grill for a bit.
Humans need different forms of protein than horses. Horses can become muscular by eating grass because they are hind-gut fermenters. The bacteria in their cecum converts plants into volatile fatty acids; we can't do that.
As for the gestation-crates, those aren't for meat animals, they're for breeding animals. Mother pigs eat a high percentage of their young. Getting eaten by your mother... how's that for animal rights?
4.4% is not a high percentage.
Have you eaten a higher percentage of your children?
I agree we eat too much meat. I killed an animal the other day with a high caliber rifle. Uhh oh, I just pissed off animal lovers, the anti-gun group, the anti-hunting league, and the meat industry with those two sentences. I helped gut it and cut it up, and I am now eating that meat and will continue to eat the meat that is stored in my freezer. Uhh oh, I just pissed off people who don't like knifes, blood, a rotting corpse, meat and cold places . There was no waste of the meat. Uhh oh, I just pissed off every American because we are all wasteful and I claim to have not wasted. I suggest we build our own houses out of wood. Uhh oh, just pissed off people who love trees. We should find our own water and dig our own wells. Dang, just pissed off everyone again because we're too lazy to do that too. I know I am being sarcastic, and I don't like to see animals suffer either, but the truth is that I don't agree with you your agenda of eating vegetables exclusively, and you probably wish I were dead. Therein lies the difference between us. You're a vegan (and I would offend you if I called you a vegetarian who doesn't use animal products or products developed using animal testing because that doesn't have the same ring to it) who wants me to see things your way, and I am a person who eats fruits, vegetables, nuts, grains, AND meat and I respect your opinion. I wish all vegans a good life.
Well said!
But don't worry too much about pissing them off they are just a bunch of fruits, nuts, and flakes
i am a vegetarian. However, the rampage this woman goes on does nothing for the debate. When you attack like this in such an abrasive tone, you immediately turn off those you are trying to sway. I actually agree with just about everything she says, and all these observations at one time informed my own decisions on the matter. However, never would I jump all over someone like this. It accomplished nothing. Much better to lead by example - vegetarianism isn't a religion. it's a choice. I happen to believe it's the right one – based on morality – but I will only convince others of that by gently making them ponder the my decision rather than punching them in the f-ing face. That is, in fact, how we should conduct all the significant debates of our time. "Rallly to Restore Sanity..."
I just quickly scrolled through this mess without reading....can't believe there are this many idiots in the world...WE ARE DOOMED!
No – Just those of you that live in the northeast :)
where did SMART debate Go????
Common people!!! Maybe we are all f-ed Though not likely! BLOOD TYPE!!!! Google it! And Grow Up!
Stop making this an IDENTITY marker which only MAKES ENEMYS!!!
Vegetarians make me laugh. It's like they weren't paying attention in Health class. The four food groups? The food pyramid? Any of these things ring a bell? I'll take my cues from science and nature, rather than deprive myself of things my body needs on a groundless principle that killing animals for food is somehow morally wrong.
"Vegetarians make me laugh. It's like they weren't paying attention in Health class."
lol...I have a degree in biology and have researched vegetarian diets extensively and have lived perfectly healthily without meat. But ok. I'm sure you know better, chief.
Yeah, and I'm the King of Siam. Just because something can be done, doesn't mean that it should be. You can raise a child as a single parent, that doesn't mean it's a good idea. Since you have a "degree in Biology" you are well aware of that vegetarians are far more prone to anemia, infertility, depression, muscle erosion and dental erosion because of their diet.
No, I'm not. Because that's simply not true. You're really going to have to back up your claims with proof, because I've found studies that either contradict what you say or are simply inconclusive. Some link, maybe. "Far more prone"? Hardly. At any rate, not due to a range of different problems with a vegetarian diet but due to lazy or uninformed eaters. I've heard all the nutritional scare tactics in the book regarding vegetarianism. Consistently, almost every single one I have personally researched (out of personal concern/interest) comes up either false, inconclusive, or insignificant.
And of course, I could list all the ailments that meat consumers are "far more prone" to, such as food poisoning, cancers, heart disease, diabetes, obesity, etc. Let alone the animal welfare, environmental and food crisis issues...
I'll take my doctor's word over yours, Mr. Biology degree.
I hate Vegetarians. For every one piece of meat they refuse, I feel like I have to eat three to make up for it. It's a tough life.
What's even funnier than their diet is their politics – Almost all of them believe in man made global warming – Almost all of them practice some form of hedonistic behavior – Almost all of them are communist – Almost all of them are atheist or at a minimum multi-theists – And almost all of them want to ram their point of view up your meat eating asses or in the author's case...pussey
I F*CKING LOVE VEGETABLES. THEY TASTE SO GOOD WITH MY FULLY COOKED STEAK. Yes, I am an omnivore. Consider my dad. He's almost vegetarian- he eats mostly rice, kimchi and vegetables. But there is the occasion when beef is served- he eats it happily. He has a lot of vegan / meat eating friends, but he doesn't care about anyone's diet, only that they stay healthy. "When I was young, I was lucky to eat even a piece of meat. Now, vegetables is my usual diet, but I will happily eat my occasional half-cooked steak, and nobody can force me not to."-my dad. I myself eat more meat than I should. I love meat. I even ate dogs back in Korea. But, I eat vegetables, and I'm very fit. No high blood pressure/ no illnesses. On the topic of animal cruelty- my family is an "organist", we only eat certified organic foods that 1. meat -we buy from farms in the country (BC), 2. on the case of seafoods- we buy from the fishermen, 3. plants- no chemicals used. (Like Seriously.) I am against excessive animal cruelty- it sucks. Also, it's worth noting that most of this lady's points seem to be made up of anti-animal cruelty instead of other reasons. I accept that other people would like to crap out vegetable sh*t in the toilet rather than meat. But they should accept that I like crapping meat. Yes the meat guy seems a bit ignorant; but the vegan lady is too preachy. Remember the golden rule- treat others as you would like to be treated. Yes, I realize other people may have said this already. You vegans- you can rant on my comment as much as you want- but you won't change my ways, I'm sorry. But I respect your diet. Now people, go eat your favourite food, whether meat or veggies- and stop worrying about this meat/vegetable debate crap.
If they gave a 'Pulitzer Prize for Opinions', I would vote that you get the prize. That was a well written piece of meat.
I found the article to have potential strong points, but they were never realized and some of the stuff she says in her article is incorrect. Namely -we are overweight because of our consumption of soda pop. Studies have shown that there is a a direct connection between the increase in pop consumption and the increase in our waistline. The abuse with animals takes more than not eating meat to stop it. Laws must be changed so that animals are in more humane conditions. Biologically we are omnivores like it or not. We are designed to eat meat, vegetables and grains. A bear is a carnivore that chooses a more vegetarian diet and you can tell this because berries and other non- animal substances that they eat are not digested. It is the same with humans there are some vegetables like corn or nuts that we do not digest well so if a person chooses to eat meat from organic sources or grow them themselves it really is biologically and morally sound.
I like eating meat. I will continue to eat meat. Sorry, that's what animals are for. You do what you want, I will certainly do what I want.
I bet I could make a dress out of chicken skin and I'd let a hunk-de-jour eat it off of me very slowly. OOO-AAHH!
NOT DNA! Blood type. READ up on it! and stop fighting about principals.
This might be the stupidest "defense", and I use that word lightly, of vegetarianism Ive ever seen. A point by point answer would be, well, pointless, because she never said anything of merit.
lol, wow. You either can't read or just wildly dismiss opinions you disagree with without any counterpoint/argumentation of your own. Did you SEE what chef Tim Love wrote in defense of NOT being vegetarian? It was absolutely laughable, childish and thoughtless compared to Jane VM's piece. As is the average comment by meat eaters on this board (not to mention most other discussion forums regarding vegetarianism/veganism).
DAVE i think its time for bed time, now go on do me a favor and go play in traffic for a ittle bit before bed!!!!
Isn't it funny how vegetarians think they're smarter than meat eaters – I bet that they have studies conducted by vegetarians to prove their point.
But of course I never said anything about vegetarians being smarter. But if you've been through enough discussion forums on the matter like I have, certain trends become...apparent. You'll get one thoughtful response for every 10 "lol imma eat 3 animals for every one you don't", "mmm bacon", and "vegetarians are pussies" comments.
LOL....I just scrolled down and saw this by sunisouttogetme:
"I hate Vegetarians. For every one piece of meat they refuse, I feel like I have to eat three to make up for it. It's a tough life."
Don't all rush in to prove my point, fellas :).
Eat what you want, legally (drugs and cannibals). You wanna tell me what to eat?... pay my food bill!
It's in our DNA to eat meat – a strong biological urge to conquer. I'm one of those wierdos who get distressed by seeing abused or tortured animals – not so much humans. The contradiction comes from my salivating over a great T-Bone steak. Sorry – can't give it up. How about extra old cheddar cheese, bacon and eggs or an egg McMuffin. You will never see me visit a slaughter house. I don't want to wreck my protein buzz.
EVER!!!!!!! heard the SOUND of A PLANT Screaming WHILE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!KILL IT?????
Talk about a Stupid. Vegies say ALL Life is Sacred??? BS. KILL ANY THING Means YOU! KIll...
I do not care what happens to the animals before I EAT them, why in the world would i care how well the animals were treated before I killed them and ATE their tasty selves
Sounds about right. Do the gene pool a favour and don't breed.
Save the world dave and sacrifuce yourself for the environment
lol @ "tasty selves". Mmmm....
Last I checked, we are omnivores. We got all the necessary teeth.
She's a pretty hot vegan though. Rare please.
Which teeth are you talking about? The cutters up front for snapping carrots? The grinders in the back for gnashing fiber? Oh, you mean the 'canines', which sort of look like a small version of tiger fangs. Tiger fangs are perfect for tearing into hide and flesh. Your sissy 'canines' are perfect for helping to crack open the tougher skins of fruit. When's the last time you saw a human take down an herbivore with his mouth and claws? lol
By eating animal products humans are eating their way to extinction, not just because of poor health but because of the huge environmental impact of animal agriculture that contributes to global warming. There are too many humans on the planet, and we're consuming more animal products each year The problem is further exacerbated by countries outside of the US, such as China that are adopting a more westernized diet. Yes, humans will be the first species to eat themselves to extinction, not in your lifetime, but in generations to come.
"Greg. It's what's for dinner."
DA! Hope you got your blanky and binkey ... ready for beddy bye?
While you sleep, the adults will be enjoying a rack of ribs and a nice zinfandel. Nitey nite.
I mean really take a look at the picture of this ladies hand, her veins are going to pop right out WTF she has a bad case of the man hand, nasty red rocket muncher!!!!!
Hey Vegans...your tears make my food taste better.
Hey meat eaters .... your stupid comments make me feel smarter.
Ok. You made me say it. Instead of reading all of this stuff just read Genesis chapter 1. If you don't get it – Thou shalt not kill.
O.k you made me say it – Thou shalt not kill is from the ten commandments moses – Exodus 20:2–17[4] and Deuteronomy 5:6–21 not genesis.
Interesting enough what is from genesis is cain and abel – you know the vegetarian cain murdering his brother the shepard abel – Is that the suffering that you want to talk about?
True, but I don't think you can argue that- Jesus ate lamb meat. -Bible. If you're using "thou shalt not kill", from the Bible, to argue against meat eaters, it seems kind of an invalid argument to me.
Edible plants such as fruits and vegetables may have a conciousness but they do not have a central complex nervous system and thus do not feel pain. They are not sentient. The plants are meant for us to eat. We are made from the dust of the Earth assimilated throught the plants. A fruit tree will become very stressed if the fruit is not picked and will simply fall to the ground and rot.
If my only choice was to eat a living animal or die than I would. But first I would have to catch it. It would have had its time on Earth living as its Creator intended than if I were faster than it, it must surrender to the higher more evolved life form. But I do not have to make this choice. I do not have to shorten the life of another to extend my own. I have so many other choices before I take the life of another being. I choose to nourish my body with healthy plant based foods instead of feeding my mouth with whatever I think tastes good. Do no harm, live and let live. Extend this philosphy to the animal kingdom.
Red rocket muncher!!!!!!
For those of you who say humans have eaten meat since the beginning of time remember this .... Once we said humans have had slaves since the beginning of time, or women have never owned property since the beginning of time. We use that excuse to continue all sorts of abuse. Thank God people like Jane Velez-Mitchell can see new possibility and inspire change in the world. Her work inspired me to open my eyes and get real about what is going on behind those doors on the farms. When you see the truth you have complete clarity. Are you too scared to look? Ashamed? Face up. Watch a documentary called Earthlings. Get real about what humans are up to these days
Give me a break. What you just said is completely inaccurate. One doesn't have anything to do with the other.
This is an ages old tactic. First, connect two completely different thing with a shaky thread – the phrase "since time began" in this instance. Second, choose something hideous, scary or embarrassing to represent the opposing position – usually nazis or slavery – so that people will be so horrified, they'll back away from the argument.
Slavery and meat eating has nothing to do with each other. The reason people brought up that humans have been eating meat since forever is because you and others like you tried to say that eating meat was unnatural. One is a moral issue and the other is a biological issue. Unless you want to contend that biologically people should be or keep slaves. You're on your own with that one, though.
Humans are NOT at the top of the food chain. We are tasty munchies for polar bears, orcas, tigers, lions, and grizzly bears.
The last time I saw a polar bear it was swimming for it's life thousands of mile because of man made global warming – Oh wait that was photoshopped
ohhhhh snap!!!
Omega-3 - flax seeds, flax seed oil. Iron - kale with lemon juice to help me metabolize the non-heme iron. B12 – Nutritional yeast occasionally - the body recycles B-12 very efficiently. Calcium - leafy greens. All essential aminos are found in the plant kingdom - take amaranth, for instance with has every amino acid.
Do some research in your medical library on how high protein sources, like cow's milk can cause the body to deplete itself of calcium to buffer the acidic environment of a high-protein diet.
Please, eat what you want, but don't try to justify a diet based on half-truths and scare tactics.
Flax seed is EXTREMELY inefficient compared to fish oils, at least for males. You absorb VERY little EPA and DHA from flax, so you have to take a huge amount of it to equal a regular serving of fish oils.
I've never seen amaranth in my grocery store. Sorry, but I don't feel like shopping around the city looking for a plant when everyone already carries foods with complete AA profiles. Like delicious chicken. Which ALSO has B12 and iron.
What you say about flax is simply not true. Grinding flax into a powder or consuming the oil is a good source of Omega-3. Fish oil, on the other hand, may be contaminated with PCBs.
I am lucky to have many local stores with amaranth. With a little sugar, it's a delicious oatmeal-like experience. Lucky I don't have to order Bob's Red Mill Amaranth from amazon.com, for sure.
I love the amount of people that like to claim their relevant knowledge on the meat market, when most have never spent more than ten minutes around cattle or poultry or any other kind of meat. I've birthed cattle and I've seen them slaughtered. Growing up around cattle I was able to really respect and understand all the attributes that made cattle a natural marvel. But you know what the greatest marvel of it really was? A thick, juicy medium rare sirloin placed next to steaming hot potatoes and fresh-picked corn on the cob!!! Yes an evolutionary marvel and spectacle every time I sit down to a steak. The fact that we have evolved into creatures of reason, gives us the ability to understand the millenia that it took for human-kind to reach the top of the food chain! Next time you bite into a bloody red steak, you throw up a that index finger, point skyward, and give some love for homo erectus gone before for giving us the ability to enjoy the blessings of being the most powerful omnivores on the planet! Woooo! Beef it's what's for dinner!
I'm a city-slicker, guilty as charged. Then there are people like this guy: http://www.madcowboy.com/ I think he knows something about ranching.
Would Love to read it, but seems I have to pay for it. As a former Ambassador once told me... Follow the money before you come to any conclusions. But hey, I've had 17 years of ranching/farming experience so I can say that ranchers like him are about 1 to every 1,000. I've since moved on from my humble beginnings on the family farm, received two bachelors and a masters degree in areas far from the ranch, and have lived in third world countries that rely on meat every day. It's this pretentiousness of vegans that just drive me insane. Go to a country that sharecroppers/ranchers squeak out a living on winter meat and tell them that they are backwards. It's completely elitist, and most of all, it really is "unnatural."
Well, I admit it's a little like pointing to Roe and saying "see – she's against abortion now". It's a lame argument. But, just making the point that not everyone is a clueless city slicker when it comes to veg*nism and the conditions of modern ranching. You don't have to buy his books. I've heard him speak for free, on vegan podcasts. lol, yeah, I know fat chance of that too...
If animals raised for food were raised in humane conditions, would she still object to people raising them for food and eating them?
I'd imagine so, yes. Otherwise she wouldn't be vegetarian, she would eat meat and support cruelty-free meat production. Humane treatment is a start, but ultimately the use of animals for food is pointless mass slaughter, and thus abominable. If I have a pile of fruits/veggies/etc on one hand, and a live animal on the other, I don't see why its humane treatment would make it any more justifiable or ok to kill instead of just eating the vegetarian food and letting the animal live its natural life as it wants to, just like us.
Gotta love how vegetarians espouse "natural habitats" and "living naturally" for animals, and then whine when predators like us eat prey. Keep hurping and durping, vegetarians!
Can't think of any natural carnivore that ruins ecosystems at a rate of knots by breeding its prey in monstrous factories.
Gotta love how Guy appeals to "food chain" and "us predators", when apparently the only naturally grown piece of meat he ever tasted was someone's dick. Got any more herps to derp, Guy?
lady shut your meat hole!!!! please crawl back from whatever rock you came from. I mean what are you trying to say stop feeding the animals because of methane gas and they consume all this grass that some starving person may need. I just want to know if you have ever tried meat before,,,,,,maybe in college at one of those parties you know what im talking about::::: you red rocket muncher!!!!!!
What a nonsense post. I doubt you know much of college or higher education in general. There is a lot of validity to her arguments about pollution and the human food crisis if you bothered to think about it or research it.
Dave you are doing such a good job commenting on peoples post great job buddy i am proud of you....now shut your meat hole as well and grow a cucumber will ya..
Well. You showed me.
A vegetarian/vegan diet is absolutely not guilt-free in the slightest. Sorry if you're unaware, but you usually require big machinery to harvest the massive amount of craps that it takes to give someone energy equivalent to meat. And what gets caught in that big slicing machinery? Small animals like shrews, field mouse, moles, etc. So don't start with the morality of eating meat, because herbivores are just as guilty as we are.
So yes, my plate might be "dripping in blood" when I eat a "carcass". But at least the animal I kill I USE. At least I don't waste the animal that gave its life for me. Unlike you, you reprehensible, self-righteous twit.
Oh, and plant protein does not have a complete amino acid profile like meat does, so that's another strike against your unhealthy diet. The only reason meat-eaters are "less healthy" is because vegetarians are less likely to smoke, drink alcohol, or drink those disgusting, HFCS-riddled, worthless soft drinks that so many fat Americans know and love.
Plants do have all the amino acids we need. Look up amaranth on http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/cereal-grains-and-pasta/5676/2 for a super-example of this - look at it's amino acid profile on the protein quality chart. And, no, you don't have to eat rice and beans with every meal.
The argument about killing plants and the animals in the field with the plants goes 10x over with a meat diet. It's killing way more plants and field mice to feed the 8-16 lbs. of plant protein that must go into a vegetarian animal to get 1 lb. of protein out. Think about it.
Silly me. I wasn't aware that animals grazing on grass required huge machinery. I guess cows have trouble chewing, so we need to chop up their food for them, right?
*facepalm*
Do you realize how much plant food is cultivated for meat consumption? Not only are you killing animals by choice, but the harvesting processes that may harm small animals that you suddenly care so much about go on in far greater intensity for the combined vegetable intake of yourslef and of the animals you consume. You simply can't win this argument, because vegetarianism will always be a strict subset of the processes involved for omnivory. Any way you slice it, meat consumption causes far greater death and environmental harm. And that does change by whatever half-truths and excuses you contrive to make yourself feel better. So nice try, you "reprehensible twit".
"Oh, and plant protein does not have a complete amino acid profile like meat does"
Vegetarian food provides ALL of the essential amino acids. Do your research, Guy. Thanks for showing your lack of knowledge on the issue. I hope your little rant made you feel better, because it certainly didn't make you look any better.
typo: "And that *doesn't* change by whatever half-truths..."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDCAAS
The ONLY vegetarian food in there with a complete or nearly-complete AA profile is soy. And I don't want to have to worry about phytoestrogens. I'm much more comfortable putting in protein I know won't harm my body.
Sheesh, you'd think with all of the vegetarians in here, at least one of them would know how to use google.
The point, for many vegetarians and vegans, is to reduce the amount of sufering we cause. By buying from grocery stores and other large chains, I'd say that most of us acknowledge that there is no way to completely eliminate the impact we have. Big corporations have made that impossible. However, many people who adopt a more vegetarian or vegan diet also have started turning to people growing food locally....which I believe completely eliminates that part of your argument, as these people in fact DON'T get crops using machinery that accidentally kills animals.
Furthermore, the animals that are killed by those machines don't suffer the cramped, malnourished torture that those in factory farms do. So it a different situation.
Correction: It *is* a different situation.
Vegetarianism is not sustainable, either. There simply isn't enough room to grow enough crops to feed everyone in the world. Cutting out all meat and dairy is not the answer to the obesity crisis, and neither is eating a diet consisting of large amounts of red meat. The key to healthy living is moderation. Neither Tim Love, nor Jane Valdez, responded appropriately here. They both took extremist points of view.
As for the disgusting conditions of the farms, that is something that the government should be regulating. Also, if you don't agree with these conditions but want to eat meat, buy free range. Or consider raising your own chickens (if you have the means). There are more options available. Besides soy is one of the most destructive crops to the environment, so even vegetarianism isn't perfect.
Caroline – Most crops go toward animal production, not human consumption. The government USDA and FDA are grossly underfunded and staffed. They could never monitor factory farms.
It is amazing how many comments this subject has generated ~ CNN will take note to be sure . . . .
I don't know if Tristan's point was previously addressed but it is a valid one indeed. Before and during the slaughtering process animals feel intense fear and pain, and just like with humans, all of that fear produces adrenaline. When you eat meat you are taking in that adrenaline, essentially your are taking in the 'fear' and pain that animal experienced before and during the slaughter process. The following is a very disturbing video of a slaughter . . . . CAUTION, it is very graphic but gets the point across about pain and suffering. http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=158410984170987&ref=mf
So this article and discussion got me interested, and I decided to look up the actual medical analysis and recommendations on vegetarianism/veganism (as a med student I have access to the "definitive" sources, such as UpToDate.)
Here's the bottom line:
Potential benefits: Leaner
Potential problems: Omega-3 deficiency, iron deficiency/anemia, B12 deficiency (only available by animal sources fyi), insufficienct energy consumption due to premature satiety from high fiber, essential amino acid deficiency, calcium deficiency
Not an ice cube's chance in hell that I will be recommending this lifestyle to any of my future patients, especially when it comes to their kids, as my confidence that the average person has the time, interest, and ability to manage this exhaustive list of potentially serious issues (especially for a growing child) is quite low.
Especially when one considers that all of this can be avoided by a well balanced diet that includes normal sources of animal derived nutrients, my resolve is only further solidified.
Do we have a dietary crisis in this country? Yes! However, the answer is BALANCE, not a shift from one extreme to another. The issues with obesity, diabetes, atherosclerosis etc. are so much more complex than what can be explained by consumption of meat. Cooking methods, variety of foods, *PORTIONS*, and *LIFESTYLE* are all infinitely more important.
Hooray for reason!
Sorry for the repost. This was supposed to be a reply to MD/PhD Student.
Omega-3 – flax seeds, flax seed oil. Iron – kale with lemon juice to help me metabolize the non-heme iron. B12 – Nutritional yeast occasionally – the body recycles B-12 very efficiently. Calcium – leafy greens. All essential aminos are found in the plant kingdom – take amaranth, for instance with has every amino acid.
Do some research in your medical library on how high protein sources, like cow's milk can cause the body to deplete itself of calcium to buffer the acidic environment of a high-protein diet.
Please, eat what you want, but don't try to justify a diet based on half-truths and scare tactics.
I'm not sure if you expected your user name to garner more significance or validity of your comments, but suffice it to say it doesn't sound like I'd be going to you for advice. Apparently the extent of your knowledge about vegetarianism is an extremely simplistic personal view based on some random data you apparently looked up. And suddenly you consider vegetarianism to be a horrible idea. You never actually tried it...at all...have you. Or done much research into it. I went from regular meat consumption to vegetarian (and borderline vegan) in an instant at the start of this year. And fyi I'm not the most organized person or a fancy cook by any means. Ie I'm an average cuilinary simpleton. And somehow I'm in the exact same health I was before I gave up meat. Crazy how that works. People like you don't realize how simple it can be. You just hear or read one or two things and use it as a scare tactic for yourself and others as a convenient excuse for sticking to eating meat that you never intended on giving up in the first place.
All the "problems" you describe would be for someone who was a very lazy and uninformed vegetarian. The exact same thing can be said of someone for ANY diet. A lazy and nutritionally uninformed omnivore will have health issues as well. And a great deal many do. Shall I make a benefits vs problems list for you regarding meat consumption? You know...cancers, food poisoning, heart disease, etc.? Well I'm sure you are aware of all the issues pertaining to meat-related diets. You are an MD/PhD, after all...
You folks missed the point.
My concerns have nothing to do with you, the responsible vegetarian/vegan. I will not recommend this to other patients, as the potential pitfalls far outweigh the benefits. More power to you for being responsible enough to handle the vege lifestyle. I guarantee that the average American is not that responsible. It's enough of a challenge just to get people to eat X number of servings of various food groups as it is, do you really believe we're going to get them to eat "X for calcium, Y for zinc, etc. etc." Live a few seconds in a clinicians shoes and you'll realize very quickly how impossible it would be.
Oh and, fyi, most of those nutritional deficiencies are insidious, the effects of which take quite a long time to observe. Not everything boils down to a medical emergency.
So you're a MD (supposedly) and a PhD candidate (again, supposedly), and the ONLY pro to a vegetarian diet you could come up with is that it makes you leaner? I find it hard to believe that you did any actual research. If you did actually do research, I find it even harder to believe that you made it through med school and are now pursuing your PhD, because your research skills are very poor.
Gawd, that chef is a real hick! No surpsise though, considering he's from Texas.
Easy, Brian. There are a lot of us vegetarian animal lovers in Texas.
I've been vegetarian for 6 years, but don't get these comments. Meat eaters always seem to be absolutely mean-spirited when they find out someone is vegetarian. Why all the animosity?
I was wondering about all the rage myself, Jeff. Many of them will tell you that it is about "preachiness'. There are some of those, but most of the vegetarians that I know are very laid back and into letting people pursue their own path. Still, the hate seems to be directed at anyone who finds eating meat or killing animals to be sad or otherwise offensive.
Exactly- my girlfriend is not vegetarian...in fact I've never dated a vegetarian. It's just a complete non-issue.
Hitler was a vegetarian.
Not that it matters, but NO, Hitler was not a vegetarian. Common myth. http://www.naturalnews.com/025163_Hitler_vegetarian_vegetarianism.html
Sorry Roger but going to have to play the B.S. card on ya! SNOPE ya buddy!
Per Snopes: http://www.snopes.com/glurge/twoquestions.asp
It basically states in "later life" Hitler was primarily a vegitarian due to a gastric condition. You know the part of his life when he turned into a real monster.
Next time, don't send us to a vegitarian web site to spew the misinformation, maybe he ate meat earlier in life.
I like snopes, but I think they got this wrong. Some people consider mostly not eating meat as vegetarian. Hitler was one of those. He was not a vegetarian. I would post a link to a carnivore site, but can't find one. Like, I said, it doesn't prove anything anyway. It's just a silly thing people like to post like it implies evil people are vegetarians. lol
There is reason to believe that a myth of vegetarianism may have been part of Hitler's propaganda. See the relevant section of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler's_vegetarianism.
He ate a bullet not carrots or lettuce!
Because you all seem to portray a superior and condescending attitude toward the rest of us.
every single vegetarian in the whole wide world, huh?
Re: the hateful variety....there are also those who are just trying to shock people and of course you have some adolescents. Some people come on the boards just to instigate trouble. The subject could really be about anything at all.
LOL! "Meat eaters always seem to be absolutely mean-spirited". So, there are absolutely no "kind-spirited" meat eaters, or "always" seemingly so. Do you see a problem with your absolute style of logic?
I would have to agree. Generalizations are bad.
Are you for real? You're talking about 99% of the world population. What an absolutel moronic statement.
Hmm...I guess Louisa didn't realize that you were quoting another.
Jeff, the other thing is, I really don't know why they care what we think. I don't care what anybody thinks of what I eat, or do, or say or wear, etc.
Read Velez-Mitchell's screed again. She makes omnivorism sound like vampirism. Vegetarianism is fine, but smug self-righteousness is not.
Read Velez-Mitchell's screed again. She makes omnivorism sound like vampirism, or even cannibalism. Being vegetarian is fine, but shrill self-righteousness is not.
Oops. Sorry for the Double-Double (mmmmmmmmm, In-N-Out....)
I thought portion control and lack of physical activity was the reason people were getting fat. Overall, we all live in a great time and country. We have time to complain about food preferences when I'm pretty sure other countries eat whatever they can get their hands on.
First of all, we aren't getting fat because we're eating too much meat. We're getting fat because we were all so trusting and bought into the "low-fat" crap that the government has been selling us for the last 25 years. Look at the data. People started eating more carbs (think: whole grains) as fillers because we had been told that fat would kill us, yet we were STILL hungry, and the scales crept higher. Look, humans evolved for YEARS on meats and some fruits/vegetables. Riddle me this: If plant life around us froze or died during the winter, exactly what plants did we eat all winter? Not all of us evolved in the tropics, so we must have eaten....MEAT! No, I don't agree with factory farming, but there are MANY humane/organic/sane sources for meats out there. All you have to do is look, and create a market for them, and they will flourish. BTW, bacon has NEVER made me sad.
Vegans better preach to the venus fly trap plant on what is proper to eat! LOL
There are 5 topics that cause sure-fire debates on CNN: 1) politics; 2) abortion; 3) sexual orientation; 4) religion; 5) vegetarianism. Wait; maybe it's all politics?
People still have not figured out that you aren't going to sway someone to your position by arguing with them and insulting them. Honestly, I think that a lot of people are just chomping at the bit to be nasty to someone and they'll take any excuse to do so.
True. I generally try not to comment, but this article struck a nerve in me because of all the vile words. When folks attack a person or a group of people, that's not a true debate. Vegetarians and Vegans are people who discovered facts and conditions that turned them off meat. Why is that bad? Meat eaters either don't know or refuse to acknowledge what goes into meat production. Why is that good? I don't see why they have a need to attack since they clearly outnumber us. It's just bullying.
"Children often naturally shun the taste of meat but are forced by their misguided, although well-meaning, parents into eating it anyway. Eventually, they develop a taste for it and it becomes their 'normal.'" My meat eating children (teens and adults) are healthy and thin. Jane is a lil' over the top... and maybe misguided?
What a line of bull. Our two kids never displayed a shunning of meat. Scientifically humans are omnivores, that's a fact! Neither favoring one food over another except for personal preference. Talk about a "well-meaning" misguided physiological observation.
There's room in this world for all God's creatures... right next to the mashed potatoes.
Reading this article makes me crave bacon.
Veganism is an eating disorder.
oh brother
Mmm protein
All in moderation....each in the season there of.
Humans are omnivores deal with it. Plants do feel ...something as evidenced by studies and kirlian photography.
"Guilt free eating" Uh, didnt occur to me that I should feel guilty for hunting, killing and eating living creatures. Humans are the only critters on the planet that have a problem with killing and eating. And those humans with that problem tend to be big city or suburban dwellers with little or no exposure to where food actually comes from. And zero knowledge of how to survive in nature on your own. Pathetic really. I'd bet that most vegans are anti gun as well.
What happens in factory farming/meat industry is not remotely similar to what happens when you hunt an individual animal. I'm not into hunting, but I am willing to assume that the animal had chance at a normal life right before you shot it. The animals raised by the meat industry are treated horribly. The people who work in the meat industry are treated horribly. The general public is eating meat that isn't good for them because of the conditions in the factories. The general public doesn't hunt for their food.
You are correct. I honestly cant conscience what happens in most of those places. I physically could not be there without getting bothered if not actually ill.
Yes the animal has a nice normal life. I actually dont shoot animals...well with guns. I bow hunt. Killing with guns is easy, a bow takes skill, knowledge and patience. I waste nothing that can be used. Think that is a side effect of my father making me eat the mocking bird I shot in the yard when I was 11. "You kill it...you eat it." I get so tempted to catch more fish (for example) than I can eat. Takes some control.
In general the meat industry is a sad affair. I buy grass fed beef and dont buy beef from the store. My eggs come from the chickens out back.
I dont feel all the stuff they inject in them is good for you. Don't think genetically modified plants are good either but that's another topic.
But this is all irrelevant, meat is moderation and in the season there of is good for you. Plants are great but do not a whole diet make.
cheerio
What a dumb whore.
if I ate her pussy would she be mad at me?
Vegans are skinny, cranky folks. It's too many veggies.
Vegetarians I can respect for making that particular choice. Sanctimonious snob I cannot.
Ditto except that every vegetarian I've ever met is nuttier than a squirrel turd. Just sayin' ...
Once you read The China Study ( a book) you will never eat animal flesh again- seriously. I was a died in the wool meat eater till I read it-- must read !!!
the China Study is crap and full of cherry-picked results. Try again.
all these people are saying that just because bears and sharks and other animals eat meat, humans have to? thats stupid. We as humans have a choice, unlike other creatures. and as the most evolved beings of this planet it is our duty to conserve our earth, to protect it for our kids. it also has tremendous health benefits.
"America’s over-consumption of meat and dairy is largely responsible for our nation’s obesity crisis."
Well, she simply does not know what she is talking about. This is a flat-out, indisputable, idiotic untruth. If Ms. Velez-Mitchell went on, say, a traditional Native Alaskan, which consists almost entirely fo animal products, and did some exercise and drank her daily water, she'd be in fine shape. The FACT is, the obesity elpidemic is FAR more a result of the mass consumption of sugars adn grains and starches, from sugary cereals in the mornings, to all the fries and breads in fast food, to all the cakes and cookies and chips and Doritos considered "snacks" in todays corporate-speak, etc., as well as the governments abandonment of children's physical fitness in the schools due to lack of funding, adn curriculums that focus incorrectly on only the Three R'S: Reading, 'Riting adn 'Rithmatic. (And if THAT slogan doesn't demonstrate the state of our education system, I don't know what does!)
Studies have shown that a pure vegan diet is detrimental to a child's development. An infant needs the right about of protein and vitamins. Soy milk and fruit juice do not give enough nutrition. Vegan diets lack in vitamins A, B and D, and minerals like calcium and zinc. Pure vegan diets lack DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty fish. This is vital in the development for the eyes and brain to develop properly. Supplying an infant with the missing supplements (which violates a pure vegan diet), may be possible but hard to achieve.
Holy crap Balaji.....funny reasoning. "But most of people are terrified of the thought or sight of Blood. So humans are not carnivores psychologically. "
LOL, thats because people are not exposed to blood and butchering. Goto africa where there is no supermarket. You wont find any squeemish peeps. Does that mean they are not human psychologically then?
Putting aside the numerous logical mistakes and errors of style;
she mis-spelled "peek" in the last sentence of paragraph one under point #3, and she clearly doesn't understand what "I.Q." is since she claims pigs have an "I.Q. similar to dogs" (I.Q. is the ratio of one's intellectual age to one's physical age multiplied by 100). It makes no sense to talk about one group or species of animal having an IQ similar to another species or group. I know these aren't really the core points, but it's hard to ignore that whenever you hear a vegan go off on a rant they end up sounding not-very-intelligent for reasons both related and unrelated to their principles.
So Jane Valez-Mitchel has an "issue" with meat. Don't her shows always include her saying "that's my issue"? Obviously she needs to talk to her therapist about all those issues – as well as this one. Her rants on all 5 points were so emotionally based that surely they must be dismissed. And "morality"? There is no high ground regarding morality that anyone can claim. Your morality is based on your own myth structure about what is right and wrong.
Try this out: Regarding your food there is no good or evil. There is no god there is no devil. there are no angels, no demons, no heaven, no hell. No afterlife. All things die sooner or later. Plants, animals, vegans and omnivores. Eat what you want. Love who you will. Enjoy yourself while you are hear. And leave me the hell alone. If you must know I hunt plants and animals. I raise plants and animals. I eat plants and animals. I am not interested in your stupid opinion about what I should or should not eat.
Then why did you take the time to post such a long response to the article? I'm confused.
So one of the reasons we should stop eating meat is because of the poor living conditions of the animals? That's a little drastic and it's not going to help the animals. Some people can stop eating meat but most people won't. So why don't we try to actually do something proactive like change the living conditions of those animals? Just a few people giving up meat really does nothing for them.
This is simply not true.
Get over yourself lady. I like my greens and I like my meat and I have no weight or energy issue at all.
I don't eat junk food or drink pop. Most of my vegetarian friends eat 30% junk food and are overweight.
Does anyone else here crave arguments for vegetarianism that don't talk about how awful it is to slaughter something? There's a reason people like you weren't alive for long 100 years ago. If you didn't want to eat, you starved. Nobody tells you that you're torturing innocent plants. You don't even know if THEY have feelings. May as well stick to water and sunlight if you want to live guilt free. The romaine will thank you.
You probably crave those arguments because deep down you also feel guilty.
You are probably a communist and a drug user
i like how civilization has advanced enough so we have the choice to elimnate the choice to not eat meat.
Huh? Wat u say? -> lol
Humans are Vegetarians.
Psychological Reason
==================
If Humans are Carnivores then they should be ready to lap up the Blood of a dead animal as breakfast. But most of people are terrified of the thought or sight of Blood. So humans are not carnivores psychologically.
Economical Reason
--------
90% of the grains fed to build the animals body is used to build the bones of animal which humans cannot consume. So you only get 10% worth of the grains. So it is not economically to keep producing meat. I heard in NPR that if the human population grows at this rate, by 2050 it would not be sustainable to produce meat and most of the people have to be vegans.
Environmental Reason
---------
Plants only produce oxygen in exchange for carbon dioxide unlike animals which produce Methane gas. So growing plants is definitely healthier for the environment.
Health Reasons
-------
Vegetables and grains are truly low in saturated fat and cholesterol compared to meat. if X amount of bacteria is present in the grains, and Y amount of antibiotics is injected into the animal to counter it, they you are definitely getting Y amount of antibiotics in addition to the left over X into your body.
Psychological Reason
==================
Humans do lap up blood – just asked the Kmer Rouge and Pol Pot about that one – OBTW They mostly ate rice
Economical Reason
--–
That's a good one – The same one why they are genetically altering most of the vegetables. Did you know that they are researching tomatoes that are resistant to aluminum and barium? That's so when the eco wackos that have taken over the UN start spraying the atmosphere to keep our planet "cool" at least a tomato will grow in the aluminum sludge created from the constant aerosol spraying and they will have something to sell to you and whoever else might survive. Say hi to them when you see those nice white streaks across the sky – They're 'protecting' the earth with chemtrails!
Environmental Reason
---
Plants grown for commercial purposes contribute just as much pollution as meat. The pollution is in the form of algae thriving on the fertilizers used to grow vegetables and have been linked to dead spots in the ocean and coral bleachings. But wait we can eat algae.
Health Reasons
---
A balanced diet is what is healthy – Ask the inuit of alaska and canada that eat fish and meat exclusively how they have managed to live beyond 40
Economical Reason
––
Insane Wayne, you do know that omnivores such as yourself consume vegetables too, and it's hardly just vegetarians who support wacky specialized vegetable crops.
Environmental Reason
-
"Plants grown for commercial purposes contribute just as much pollution as meat."
Wrong (unless you are talking about hunted meat). Vegetarian = small vegetable matter production to feed 1 person. Omnivory = small vegetable matter production to feed 1 human plus large amounts of vegetable matter to grow and sustain 1 or more animals to also feed that person. In no way can you claim that the processes involved in vegetarianism have more impact, because livestock consume far more than a vegetarian human would, and thus require much more production and also produce much more pollution.
Health Reasons
-
"A balanced diet is what is healthy – Ask the inuit of alaska and canada that eat fish and meat exclusively how they have managed to live beyond 40"
Actually I agree. Except that these days I would hardly recommend living off of arctic meat due to mercury contamination. Yet another dietary danger that only meat consumption is concerned with.
The entire argument from both sides is stupid. Simply look at your teeth – you've got omnivore dentition. Like most omnivores, humans have evolved to eat anything – animal or plant – that we can arm wrestle down our throats
So we've evolved to be fat and sick? I don't think this argument holds ground. Just because we can, doesn't mean it's best. Studies have shown that native Americans used to only eat animals in times of famine or drought. When is the last time you saw a dead animal on the side of the road and felt like that was what you should eat? You would only do that if you were starving to death, right? So, yeah, we CAN, but it's still gross in my opinion.
Paraphrasing, right? While we're talking crazy, let's teach lions to eat tofu! Those poor antelopes :(
Being a vegetarian is an aesthetic choice and you are welcome to make it. Your comment about evolving to be "fat and sick' has nothing to do with the fact that humans are functionally omnivores. The latter is a neutral fact, while your comment is a prejudiced perspective implying that vegetarians are more evolved. Some days I eat a vegetarian diet, some days a meat heavy diet, other days a well balanced mixture. Every thing in moderation and balance.
Well, I'm not a lion, and I like tofu. :)
Yes, I do believe vegetarians are more evolved actually.
I like tofu also – particularly when tossed in the wok with a hot spicy garlicky sauce. And like you, I am not a lion (a carnivore – look at it's teeth), Instead, I'm an omnivore and eat like one.
LOL – please take me with a grain of salt. I'm actually just in a mood right now. But I do think I've made the right choices for me personally. I do agree that one's diet is a personal choice. It would be hypocritical to think otherwise. I don't judge you, you don't judge me...
Being a vegetarian is a political choice – The same people that brought you avatar are just waiting for all you the meat eating borgs to join their collective and be led to the slaughter by the NWO like the sheeple that you are
If your proof is going back in time, what was before agriculture? HUNTER/gatherers.
The truth hurts doesn't it. VEGANS all the way!!!!!!!!
lets veggies be veggies and let natural selection take its course
Exactly – enjoy your cancer.
Enjoy your monsanto genetically modified seed grown vegetables while your texting your vegan recipes to your friends from facebook and sitting on the couch doing a bong hit after meditating and yoga and voting for obama
I enjoy hunting and eating anything that walks on all fours....... Especially when its roasted over an open flame...... I also enjoy diving and spearing any number of large game fish...... And eating that raw usually with rice and beer....... I don't have a problem with most veggies but I do have a problem with the obnoxious preachy ones...... To each his own people
I believe she was merely responding to the obnoxious chef.
like i said there boss to EACH HIS OWN
And yet you have a "problem" with what she says.
You miss the point in the end its a pointless argument..... why be an arse about it.... enjoy what you enjoy and let others enjoy what they enjoy..... this world would be better off with out fanatics of all kinds....... people need balance....... you tip a scale to far to one side in any direction and no good will come of it....... thats all I'm gonna give you boss I bid you goodnight and live life......
@bit you seem a tad bitter..... to many turnips???? I have read both articles..... And ya'll taking the Chef way to seriously for your own good..... Where this gal writes a rather bitter and angry angry article...... Using factory farming and things like "rotting" meat as her only points in validating the life style of vegan/veggy......... Hence she is a twit...... And I do give the point to Az that you are being a bit of an arse about this......
...but, anyway, have fun! Enjoy!
"To each their own" and yet you are calling me an arse? : ) Jane was presenting a valid argument, and everyone jumped on her case. I felt a need to defend her, not that she needs my help. I'm curious; did you have the same reaction to Chef Tim Love's article?
goodnight troll :P
you only prove the point it's pointless
I'll save you folks the trouble the comments that are worth looking for are Phd students and Azreals are the only ones with any level of sense who have posted on this board.......
op and I just noticed Logics and brians comments there worth a look too
One Reason Not To Be A Vegetarian. Its unnatural.
The major theme I gleaned off this whole article was that Jane has a problem with factory farming...What about those in my family that have dairy, hog and chicken farms...which I have been to and have not seen inhumane practice in their barns and pens. There are many animals raised and sold like that today...but they are more expensive...I assure you ma'am that they are right there in the Whole Foods down the way from your tofurky dogs. If you look at the statement the guy made about meat consumption...I read the 'in moderation' statement', whereas it seemed she breezed over it to go into that 'preachy' vegetarian mode. Variation is what makes a good diet...we were hunter/gatherers...Im not saying lose the meat...just make it the smallest focus about half of the week...I love meat...but I eat more than one vegetarian dinner a week
Is this woman aware that plants are alive, and that it's impossible to eat without killing. Fruits and nuts are plant embryos. There is no such thing as guilt free eating, you must kill to survive, end of story. Plenty of studies have shown that plants feel pain and do their best to not become animal food, but such is the way of the world.
You say there's no such thing as guilt-free eating...therefore let the inhumane treatment continue? Please read Why We Love Dogs, Eat Pigs and Wear Cows; then decide celery suffers as much as the animals (and workers) in the meat industry do. This business breeds sadistic behavior. It's not like it used to be where a chicken led a basically peaceful like right up to the point when their head was chopped off. If we're going to eat an animal, we should at least show it some respect.
Hey PLP Irukandji, the 1950's called and they want their sexist derogatory name for women back. I hope you choke on your meat.
im a vegetarian, born and raised, and you do sound a kinda preachy.. to each his or her own..
GREAT article! I totally agree with the author!!
Anybody else find it ironic that the background of the Eatocracy banner at the top of the screen is a close up of a giant piece of meat. Man!! I totally want steak now.
Oh! Now its a lemon. Not so ironic anymore.
P.S. Tim Love cooks and sells meat, so of course he wants people to eat it. I don't think he's in any danger of losing business. There's no need to criticize those who abstain from meat.
Monk – Your statement "People who eat meat don't push it on vegetarians, so shut up and leave us alone" is moronic.
I have never, ever preached to anyone I know about why they should stop eating meat, and yet on an almost daily basis, I am constantly asked by strangers, friends and family – Don't you miss meat? Don't you want some of this steak? Don't you think you should eat this so you don't lack protein / iron /whatever? People can't open their minds to other ways of eating a fulfilling meal that doesn't involve a main course that once had a mother, eyes and a beating heart. I don't preach to you, so don't tell me that I'm self-righteous and superior.
Also, the argument that 'people have been eating meat since the beginning' of whenever is ridiculous. They also used to walk hunched over, use rocks for tools and grunt for language. It's ok to evolve and be educated on what you are putting into your mouth.
I know what you mean. My family especially. When they ask if I'm getting enough protein, I say "Sure. Are you getting enough fiber?"
Since when is compassion offensive? Her list does make more sense. It takes considerable bravery and commitment to be vegan or vegetarian in this country because we're so out-numbered. Reactions range from mild ignorance to downright vicious attacks. You see it here in these comments. I grew up eating meat and liked it very much when I decided to give it up in middle age due to basically everything Jane said here. I have not regretted my decision in any way. I'm not morally opposed to consuming meat; I'm opposed to the way meat is produced.
Reason #6. You not eating any meat leaves more meat for me. Enjoy your twigs.
We have canines. We are omnivores. We were meant to eat meat AND vegetables. Animals die, so what? its the way life works.
And then there are bunch of people that haven't tried Indian Vege Food. Period.
That woman looks like she's about to die. Give her a Double-Double from In N' Out, STAT! We only have minutes to save that scraggily waif from doom.
That chick is a lesbian? Too bad, at the rate gay people are offing themselves lately she won't live long enough to get any of those vaunted health benefits.
A counter to all her points since the "meat eater" obviously fails:
1. Rotting animal carcass is awesome. I love the taste of a rare piece of steak, well cooked chicken, pork, or lamb. I don't feel guilty about eating them. I'm also in great shape because I excercise.
2. Bacon smells awesome. How can you not love it? As far as the pigs IQ. I don't care! It's an animal that is meant for me to eat. Would she eat a pig/bacon if it smelled fresh air and saw the sky?
3. I eat meat in piece every single day...for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Finally "world hunger" would be solved if those indians stopped treating the cow as a god (since the population of India is huge thats a big chunk).
4. Unless you eat the salad without any dressing you are still going to get huge. Sorry Mrs. Velez but your barking up the wrong tree.
5. Yeah I'll feed my turkey all right...to make sure its nice and fat for me to eat. Tofurky is horrible, I've tried it before...needs salt.
This woman is lucky she is good looking otherwise no one would put up with her crap. Even then I question if her husband is straight.
Dude....see Food Inc. and Home documentaries. They show how meat eaters pollute the world and destroy the earth.
I have seen Food Inc. and Fast Food Nation...still haven't changed my mind. As it says inside every Fatburger restaurant "Man did not crawl to the top of the food chain to eat soy"
I understand the arguments about animal cruelty and global warming, but what always turns me off about these pro-vegetarian arguments is the insistence that humans aren't designed to eat meat, or have no natural inclination to do so. Bull. The reality (as any palentologist or dietary scientist can tell you–or heck, just open your mouth and look at your teeth) is that we evolved as omnivorous mammals, eating both things that we found and things that we killed, and those tastes are still with us. The things that tasted best to us (meat, fat, sugar) did so because they provided the most effective nutrition for our needs at the time. Why do you think there are so many cave paintings of buffalo hunts? You can't "trick" somebody into thinking something tastes good. If that were the case, we'd all just trick ourselves into liking spinich. Problem solved! Hey, I agree that being a vegetarian is healthier and better lifestyle–just don't tell me it's more "natural".
The carnivores are calling the vegetarians preachy (and then follow that remark by...preaching. pointing out that humans have eaten meat since the beginning of time...yes, and only until a few hundred years ago people thought a solar eclipse involved a dragon eating the sun to display God's anger). There are a LOT of things we have done since the beginning of time that have been pretty stupid. In fact, most things done by our ancestors has been found to be outdated and unintelligent by today's standards. We used to use leeches to draw out "bad blood". We sacrificed virgins to appease an unverified God. We thought the sun revolved around the earth and that our planet itself was flat. Sarah Palin still believes that Jesus Christ himself is going to make a sequel appearance IN HER LIFETIME. Not even a peep for the last 2 millennia, but now that she's on the planet, he MUST be coming back for HER!
Oh, and for all you meat eaters out there who just looove your delicious steaks and lamb chops and other assorted animal carcasses, try eating free range animals. Don't buy the stuff you find in grocery stores – that has extra salt and other additives to make your meat taste good. Free range has nothing but dead animal. Switch to that just once. Then you'll really taste the truth.
And stop whining about the "holier than thou" issue. Watch documentaries about slaughter houses and factory farms. You'd feel good about yourself too if you realized that you weren't causing the images in those films.
What don't you understand about being the top of the food chain? We catch fish to eat it, causing it suffering. We pave the forests to make room for our houses, causing suffering. We drain the swamps and dam rivers, again causing suffering. Planting crops and harvesting them also causes suffering, FYI a ton of animals are killed during harvest of your soybeans and a forest was probably paved down so you could choke on your squash.
So it's the truth that I'm tasting when I eat free range? Then the truth is delicious. Especially grass-fed truth.
Yes, they used to believe the earth was flat, but your argument that eating meat is like believing the earth is flat is begging the question and ludicrious. It's called faulty logic. They also thought that drinking water was a good idea, so is that passe and incorrect now too?
Great article Jane! Thanks so much for all you do to promote compassion in our too violent world.
lul at all the dumb vegetarians choking on their white bread and butter "cuz it haz no dead animal in it."
PS. you don't get fat from proteins, you get fat from carbohydrates. Also man made contribution to greenhouse gases is like 2%
This article gives me another reason to dislike JVM. She screams at the tv camera and she had a gigantic mouth. Not to mention her voice gets on my nerves. Now she has the nerve to preach to people about why we shouldn't eat meat. Would someone please stuff a rare steak down this woman's throat.
Okay vegetarians, if your diet is so healthy then tell me where you get vitamin B-12 from? Vitamin B-12 is a required in the formation of red blood cells and the only reliable source of it is from animal protein. If you are a vegetarian and take B-12 suppliments you are still part of the food chain, killing a cow, chicken or some other animal for your neccesary nutients. See there is no such thing as a true vegetarian.
Vegans are everywhere in my social circle, and I have yet to meet one who isn't a self-righteous ideologue. They preach tolerance and compassion, but when confronted with an omnivorous diet, they exhibit only scorn and condescension. I feel zero guilt about eating meat. Yes, it has a severe impact on the environment, but I eat it in moderation and buy organic when I can afford to. Americans are suffering from an epidemic of obesity on account of what they eat, but I don't know a single omnivore who is suffering from anemia.
I bought a cornish game hen today. Don't worry, I didn't eat it. I washed it off and wore it on my dick like a condom. After about 6 pumps, I shot my clammy load into it's cavity and tossed it into the garbage.
I love animals!
I love you!
Imagine the impact that it would have on the entire world if only the U.S. went completely vegan 1. The poor of the world would starve due to the fact that Americans would be spending all of their formerly meat eating budgets on only vegetables. Do you really think that Ethiopians would have enough funds to compete in the supply demand curve created? 2) The rivers and the oceans would turn into one big green algae pit from all of the fertilizers that would be dumped onto the world's soil just to produce the vegetables in the quantities required for U.S. Only consumption. After all, prior to the oil spill their was a dead zone at the mouth of the Mississippi river due to algae eating the oxygen out of the water fed by fertilizer from all the mid west corn fields. Think before engaging your emotion driver brains you animals
Your logic is so off, I don't know where to begin. Please do some research before you type something like that. Heaven forbid anyone actually take it seriously. More square miles of vegetables don't necessarily need to be grown, they just need to be fed to PEOPLE rather than to animals raised for their flesh.
I find it extremely unfortunate that animals are treated in the harsh conditions they are today.
However, I see the value in eating meats and the nutrients contained within said meats.
I think it is extremely important to change the way that animals are treated. (I also agree that America eats far too much meat. KFC double down... *Shudders*)
But, I think that meat should stay in our diet (For those who choose to have meat in their diet)
P.S. Studies have shown that yelling, and attacking (Trolling) people based on their beliefs does not often sway their beliefs, and instead makes them clutch to said beliefs all the more.
P.P.S. Grammar Police; be nice to me. I'm only 14.
For anyone who wants to know the truth behind why eating meat and dairy is actually good for you they should go to http://www.westonaprice.org and read the science behind it. These baseless articles are full of opinion and lacking fact. This ladys counterpoints are empty and biased.
Venus fly-traps. Plants that eat meat. Don't they care about those poor suffering frogs and insects dying slowly in the jaws of that cold-cholorphylled plant?? We're more intelligent that the other animals. They are not our equals. Other animals eat animals, so it's good enough for me. Sorry, meat tastes good and if we were meant not to eat it human taste buds would say so. Plants are treated more and more with pesticides/chemicals because they are so genetically altered that's it's affecting their ability to fend off pests by using natural methods that evolved over millions of years. Too many people care so much about animals while disrespecting and belittling their human neighbors. People starve while many pet owners give their pets a higher standard of living than people in third world countries. Pet overpopulation is destroying the world almost as much as the animals we eat. Pet owning vegetarians are hypocrites, even if they feed Rover broccoli every day (enjoy the dog farts).
I think Jane VM is enlightening us about the dangers of overproduction and consumption. Moderation is key. She makes some very valid and informed arguments. I applaud her!
I question why everyone compares human beings to animals? Can you hold a relevant conversation with an animal? Can an ape program a computer or resolve our economic crisis? No...I eat meat and vegetables in relatively equal amounts.
1) "I would much rather devour a piece of well-seasoned squash than a slice of an animal’s rotting carcass" **It's not a rotting carcass, it's not even rotting meat, they have this new invention called refrigeration that will preserve the meat until it's ready to be eaten.
2) I'll agree with #2... bacon is pretty disgusting, but that is just my personal opinion.
3) How can you talk about peace if your plate is swimming in blood? AND Ever wonder why we’re experiencing all those salmonella and swine flu outbreaks? **Most meat is drained of blood before it's eaten.... Salmonella also infects lettuce and other veggies.... and as a former newscaster she should know that swine flu did NOT come from swine.
4)"If huge amounts of protein were the key to perfect health, America would be the healthiest nation on earth because we eat a lot more meat than people in most other countries." *** Sorry... but protein doesn't make you fat, the FAT you eat makes you fat.
5) Yes... Lets all go feed turkeys on turkeyday.
Ok, pick up your bio books and learn. 1) all plants host mites. You are eating animals every time you eat plants, MURDEREING hundreds of living animals as you chew. Eating a burger is killing fewer animals than eating broccoli. Guilt free? Keep your head in the sand. 2) Think you are a vegan but eat mushrooms? Whoa, fungi are not plants, nor are they autotrophic. They get their energy by consuming the broken down remains of organic matter, typically derived from an animal. You like eating something that broke down the feces of an animal? Mmmm, yummy. Me, I will rather eat the animal that produced the feces instead of eating a derivative of its waste. Ahh, if only real science was still taught in schools.
But calves are cute and mites are icky. lol
When we stop killing our babies in the womb, I will consider the Vegan energy well directed. Protect the humans first.
It's not a baby at 3 months old... it looks like ground up hamburger meat! With all the over population and the stress of all the state/federal aid for the poor there should be more abortions! There should be a DirecTV promotion where you get $100 off your bill for every abortion you refer to the abortionist.
Read this, the world is set for a population decline with many ramifications.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/articles/america%E2%80%99s-one-child-policy
I'm not talking about the world, I'm talking about the USA. Last year the federal govt spent 587 BILLION dollars just for kids on Medicaid. That doesn't even count Welfare, and the other helping hand funds for kids, and that doesn't count the billions spent by state programs for all of these "blessings". Teens, poor people, and the stupid are breeding like crazy, we could easily handle a few thousand more abortions a year!
Dentist, if you read the article you would see that America's population is set to decline too. We're not in as big trouble, as Singapore, or Italy but we will be. Read the article.
That's right! Until abortion is stopped, we meat-eaters will not lift a finger to be compassionate. And we refuse to help old people if babies are being killed. Afterall, babies come first! Babies come first!
Before non-humans they do.
I want to give her a tube snake. Does she tube snake boogie?
Meat isn't the enemy here, it's the careless, over processing of food that is being done to keep feeding the numbers. A lot of farmers would be happy to produce healthier foods but the demand has to go up before a lot of them will do it.
The evolution arguement has me laughing. To say we should have "Evolved" away from a meat eating species is...well...stupid. Evolution made us a meat eating species. We grew away from herbavore mammals to evolve into ominviores, most likely to fill a need we were not getting from plants alone. Evolution is not a state of mind!! You can't will your way there by some strange sence of superiority! If we were truly evolving away from the instinct to eat meat, you would have a true physical change in our appearance. For instance we would start to lose canine teeth. We would start seeing children born with all of their teeth flat. No need to have teeth to tear flesh. We are the only species on the planet that believes we are above the food chain. There NO morals conflicts in the aninal kingdom. Eat or die. Very simple. When we we step above that equation...we act as though we are above all life on Earth. And I thought God didn't beileve in evolution.
Interesting that you mention physical changes.... In the developed world, one of the most common surgeries is wisdom tooth extraction. Wisdom teeth are extra molars, good for chewing grains and vegetables. Perhaps the fact that our mouths are shrinking so that they can no longer accommodate these extra molars means we are evolving towards a diet that is higher in meats and lower in grains and vegetables....
Although, I personally believe that it's just greedy dentists taking advantage of people with insurance. It's an interesting point to ponder.
I see your point. But, wisdom tooth removal is NOT evolution.
Let me clarify.
If the wisdom teeth need to be removed, which our friend Dentist attests to, then we can only assume that there is a problem with them....
The problem is that they are growing in from the wrong position.
So let's imagine we're cavemen without any modern technology...
If we did not have any dentists to remove these poorly positioned and painful teeth, one could assume that it would cause extreme pain for the sufferer. And would interfere with their hunting and gathering caveman activities. This would cause a higher death rate in the cavemen with the bad wisdom teeth.
Some people however, would not produce wisdom teeth (just as some people are born with no left thumb or blind in one eye... just luck of the draw) These people, having no problems with painful, infected, poorly positioned wisdom teeth would be successful hunter/gatherers. They would have their pick of women because they would have more food. They would produce more offspring. And eventually, due to a higher birth rate among people lacking the wisdom teeth, and a higher death rate among those of us with them, we would be outnumbered and replaced.
Evolution at it's finest.
And dentist, I meant no offense. I'm sure most dentists are not after just money. But my dentist recommends every single person I know who goes to him to get their wisdom teeth removed. He didn't even x-ray me... It's left me soured on the experience; but I will concede that most dentists, probably the vast majority of them, are conscientious professionals.
Good point. yet i am confused on how this would support against an omnivore diet? Is it the lack of vegatables or the addition of many more types? Is the outbreak of tree nut and gluten allergies caused by a lack of a meat diet? How would we know? Evolution is generally caused by a NEED of a specices to change or die out.
Yup, that's exactly what we do. We take X-Rays that show your wisdom teeth growing sideways, causing crowding and pain, and we remove them just to get the insurance money. The real cure is to think positive thoughts, sprinkle some fairy dust and sparkles, and the pain and crowding will stop.
I like how vegetarians preach and preach about how the factories just destroy the environment. Although, the factories do contribute to globle warming and stuff, growing plants can also do some damage to the environment! Don't tell me that all those chemicals that are sprayed onto the plants are healthy for the natural world. This all really comes down to how you want to live your life, if you want to eat meat, then eat meat. If you want to be a vegetarian, then be one! Don't act like your choice is the ONLY way to live in this world. What kind of world would this be if everyone was the same?
We are NOT horses, horses have a different physiology.
Vegetarian is a healthy diet, but a vegan requires fortified foods or supplements.
You can't get B12... an essential vitamin from plants.
B12 is produced by bacteria, in the guts of herbivores... who have special stomachs for this purpose.
Humans would have to eat their own feces to get enough B12 naturally.
You know what my favorite meat? Lamb
I guess since it's still a baby, it's extra tender. Nice, juicy and gamey. I like to braise it, or perhaps roast it with some mint for a few hours. The meat becomes so soft, it lbasically melts off the bone. Om nom nom nom nom. The animal made a great sacrifice to satisfy so many higher beings, ie humans :) . Let's praise the noble lamb for his altruism :')
Where do most vegans obtain the protein in their diet? Answer: Soybeans
Guess who's the largest producer of Soybeans? Answer: Brazil
Why is Brazil now the largest producer of Soybeans? Answer: Down goes the rainforest to create more soy cropland
Vegans - the eco-green-feel-good-lovey-dovey boat you're bobbing in has got unrepairable holes and is sinking! Do us all a favor and shut-up! Oh, and tell your friends at HSUS (Humane Society of the U.S.) to stop wasting everyone's time & money brainwashing today's youth...
Is that a leather bracelet she's wearing in the photo?
For many years I worked in the food industry exporting North American grains and meat to Asia. The factory farms range in quality and actually include some great operations that take good care of their animals. Lots of wide open spaces with free range grazing. But there are also many nasty places that don't follow the rules and we have reproted and shut down a few of those. Too bad we can't get them all.
What I always wonder is if the vegetarians out there realize the changes in the food that they claim is so healthy and good for the environment. Grains and veegtables are also raised on factory-style farms that use a lot of chemicals to kill insects and weeds, and enhance productivity, just like the factory meat farms. They are also only about making money and have introduced genetically altered foods into the system. Most vegetables and fruits have significantly decreased in flavor and nutritional value over the past 20 years. If you have an opportunity to have a blood toxology test done you might be surprised how many chemicals you are pumping into your bodies, even if you are a vegan.
It isn't about meat or vegetables but about the evolution of the foodchain that supports the factory production of the food we eat. If we all went back to growing our own food and raising our own livestock we might have a bigger positive impact on our health. But society today does not allow or support that and so we all get to make our own choices on how we feed ourselves. My job doesn't allow me to have a hobby farm to raise my own food so just like most of main stream society in the developed world, I shop at local stores.
Both sides of this argument need to get all of the facts and make a decision for themselves. We can argue until the cows come home about which is right and wrong and never reach a resolution becasue this isn't an argument about absolutes.
I am looking forward to the Bison steak I will BBQ on my charcoal BBQ and eat with fresh corn on the cob, squash and new potatoes I got fromthe local market garden farm. Almost organic but not quite. Still better than the local supermarket.
There's also the whole idea that our beef is pumped full of dangerous hormones, antibiotics, and corn that was also grown with harmful chemicals; not to mention countless other mysterious feed ingredients that have included plastic, cement, feces, and even beef (yes, cannibalism) in the past. But do I care enough about it not to eat meat? Of course not.
I still cannot figure out why it would upset a meat eater if the rest of us choose not to eat it. That's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. It has zero impact on their own lives.
We really don't care that you don't want to eat meat. That's your choice. But the problem is when you:
A) Start acting smug and superior
B) Start acting as though we're evil and immoral
C) Tell us we should think the same was as you, or we're destroying the world, or our health, or the cute innocent animals or whatever.
We feel as though we are under attack, because many vegetarians want to make vegetarianism the law (see PETA)
Leave us alone, and we'll leave you alone. As a matter of fact, we wouldn't even know you were a vegetarian if you didn't feel the need to express your own self-satisfaction constantly. Once you start telling me how you feel the need to be a vegetarian because (insert your reason here), I will feel the need to tell you that I think you're nuts and that eating meat is normal.
Well Mike. Not all of us preach or tell you what to eat. I certainly don't.
Yet you seem rageful towards all vegetarians.
A lot of people in my family and circle of friends are either vegetarian or vegan, and I think they (as well as Jane) make a lot of really good arguments. Let’s face it, I haven’t heard any good (in terms of scientific) claims from meat eaters, but of course we’re all entitled to do what we want. I myself eat meat but was vegetarian for a couple years. I eventually gave in to temptation, but I’ll probably try vegetarian again once I’m not working and going to school full time and can find time to shop healthfully and prepare my own food. For now it’s a lot of eat-whatever-is-the-fastest.
The only point of hers that I think was way off was that kids are forced to like the taste of meat. I’m sorry, but if there is one thing kids don’t like the taste of it’s vegetables!!! Once it’s no longer pureed (veggie And meat baby foods), kids don’t seem to like either one.
Also, sugar and other carbs are a huge part of the obesity crisis. You can’t just blame it all on animal products.
Go to http://www.westonaprice.org and look for the Take a guided tour section in the left column. It has info on both why being a vegetarian is bad for you and the basics of nutrition.
whoops, right column.
I've got to challenge her on her 5 points.
1. I have no guilt eating meat. I do think that dairy is a far greater to obesity then meat. The sedintary life style is the leading cause of obesity.
2. Bacon is awesome.
3. She is the Holier-then-thou vegan that he talks about.
4. He says moderation, she didn't even read what he wrote the first line of what she says proves it.
5. Ah yes Tofurky. Also known as meat for people who wish they could eat meat.
She would have carried more weight with me had I had the impression that she even read what was written beforehand.
This article would be offensive if it wasn't so laughable. Smug, arrogant, and self-righteous vegetarian thinks meat is evil. Gee, thanks, I can get so much out of that. I'm going to order extra meat on my burger tonight, just for her.
I will eat anything with a pulse and I am pro global warming!
Ted Nugent has one of the more ethical approaches. Eat meat, but only if you're willing to kill it yourself. Man-up everyone! Meat is not created in a cello-wrapped styrofoam package.
Is too! It's just the way my daddy bought it and brought it to mom to cook for us.
I used to love meat – then I stopped in a veal farm in Wisconsin a couple decades back. X'ed that off the list – cruel and unusual punishment to a baby for 6 months – in a crate, can't move, anemic, diarrhea running down its rear for its 6 month life until slaughter – did not want to see that. All that pain for a tender piece of meat. Began to make me think and read.
Then the chicken house – you really don't need to see the conditions there – just look at how sick the chickens look in the next truck full of them you see on the highway – don't want that illness in my body.
My brother in law became a pig farmer – got to see it up close and personal – there was always a carcass laying around, or on a truck, or in the "buzzard pit". But most carcasses never made it out of the pens, because wounded pigs would be eaten alive by pen mates. And the amount of drugs they use to keep them growing super fast and keep from getting sick – if you had a cold, you were not allowed to visit – because they are to susceptible to lots of disease.
Ever notice that kids are developing faster – why would a growth hormone stop working after the animal it was originally in was eaten by a human? It can't tell the difference.
Recalls might be a clue too – how many mad cow scares have there been? – how many meat recalls have there been? – and most importantly, what meat should never make it to market, but does anyway for the sake of profit? Feeling queasy thinking about it.
If animals had good lives, fresh food, were drug and disease free, and had a humane end, I'd still be eating them. But because the majority of people think they need meat at every meal, it forces mass production, drug laden, poor conditions, and a terrifying and painful end for lots of them – check YouTube if you need proof. And, meat is a product not necessarily good for humans, Until something changes I'll continue to enjoy eating vegetables and Morningstar products.
And, economically – my family eats better food – mostly organic – than most meat eaters.
Concerned about our environment? Why pay for a cow or chicken to eat months of corn/grain/animal remnants when you can have a piece of corn and grain on your plate. Less water used, less fuel used, less land used, and less pollution if you just bypass the animal.
Need more info.? – the turning point for me was when a friend loaned me the book " A Diet for a new America". I read the first chapter on chicken farming, and gave it back to him. That was all I needed to know. And, I would bet – if most people saw what the how the animals they eat were raised, there would be a major shift in how they ate.
We need to stop arguing. Just like Republicans and Democrats that just attack each other and nothing good gets done. We are most likely omnivores but people can lean either way. No problem. But let's stop attacking or insulting each other. We are all in this together. If we don't start working together then nothing important or useful will be achieved.
I'm 49 years old, a vegetarian for more than 20 years and way healthier than most people my age. And there is no price on compassion. Thank you, Jane Velez-Mitchell, for expressing the views of us vegetarians on 5@5.
hmmm. I don't think the obesity crises is linked to meat.
Potato chips, chocolate bars, and sugary drinks are the main factors that contribute. Fast food burgers are bad too, but even in that, it's mostly the sodium and fat in the sauces and the sides and drinks.
Her argument is also flawed in that all her points come to the same thing... meat is bad for you because it's immoral. That's not actually an argument though, since morality is something that is socially conditioned (as is eating meat, according to her), and most people in our society don't view eating meat as wrong. She completely avoided any rebuttal in terms of actual taste, or any actual tangible health benefits. She chose, rather than complement vegetarianism, to simply insult meat-eating. This is why vegetarianism will never go main stream.... because vegetarians cannot make a decent argument that isn't based on "Killing animals is wrong, and makes you fat"
The studies demonstrate clearly that an animal based diet increases a host of diseases. Whether it's the Framingham study or the 7 nations study and a variety of others... eating a plant based diet is superior. Eat what you want, but be honest about the facts. Interesting if evolution is true that a plant based diet would be superior... evolution should have made it the opposite.
Well now that I've been preached to about my life choices enough for the day, I think I'll go to Five Guys for a delicious juicy meaty cheeseburger. Thanks for the laughs, Jane!
see you there Ban. if you get there before me please order me a burger with bacon, grilled onions and grilled mushrooms.
By design, Humans are Omnivores. We have two eyes at the front of our skull, which all predatory animals have. This unique feature gives us depth perception. Imagine, a leopard is stalking prey, and pounces... only to over shoot, because it has a limited view range.
Now, in defense of the "skull and teeth" arguement, yes, humans have teeth that are made for chewing grass, our skulls is made that way too. Along with this, we have a apendix, and other such things which grants us the ability to eat plants, and not animals exclusively. The apendix was(and is) used by animals to break down vegetable particles for maximum nutrients, but now serves no purpose, because it does not function.
There are many arguements for both sides, so here is my resolution: Zealot-like Vegetarians, I know that the animals are treated bad, but would you still blame me is I took my rifle and shot my pig, or cow?
Defensive Meat-Eaters: I understand that meat is good, and killing things with a nervous system is wrong, but how about we conform slightly more, and buy our food from the farmers where there is no involvement in factories.
I forsee that in the future, we shall all co-exist and have a balanced diet of vegetables, meat, grains, dairy, and fruit, but until that day comes, I say that we not only have the Freedom of Speech, but we also have the Freedom of Eating-whatever-sustains-our-bodies.
In closing, I would just like to say this, in some of the most inspiring words ever, Good Night, and Good Luck.
The beau
if we weren't suppose to eat meat then why do we have canines
People are very eager to justify the cruelty that our farmed animals suffer – to say it's natural or the food chain, etc. There is nothing natural about cutting off a bird's beak, forcing a pig to endure pregnancy after pregnancy while spending her whole life in a two foot crate, or taking a calf from it's mother hours after birth to live in a dark cage for a few months before being slaughtered for veal. There is nothing natural in factory farming including stuffing the animals with millions of drugs. There is nothing natural in these animals lives. Be honest about your selfish cruelty, don't pretend it's natural. Be honest about your desire to inflict pain on lesser beings. If you are honest with yourself, you might recognize the horror you participate in and may be able to change. I don't think humans truly want to be cruel. Just open your eyes to the truth.
This lady is as blind as any person who looks at an issue from only one side (such as all far-left or far-right politicians). She has some valid points, unfortunately it is almost all couched in idiotic propaganda.
Meat and dairy consumption are the main causes of this country's obesity? I call bulls***. Sure, Americans could do with lessening their portion sizes when it comes to meat and dairy. However, the main cause of our country's obesity problem is directly related to our entertainment and technological advances. Most people don't have to physically exert themselves for 12-16 hours a day any longer.
All of you, ask your mothers and fathers and grandmothers and grandfathers. Vegetarians in their days were a severe oddity. Society thought they were literally crazy. And they didn't have the obesity problem. Why? They led active lifestyles. America's obesity problem is because America is lazy.
Incidentally, healthy vegetarianism is much, much more expensive than an omnivorous diet. That's a lot to ask from a country where poverty is quickly becoming a majority. Has anyone met an unhealthy vegetarian? The complex balance and large quantities of foods they must eat to make up for the B-9, B-12 proteins, iron, etc leaves most sickly and anemic. Not to mention those vegans and vegetarians that require their quarterly B-12 shots in order to STAY ALIVE, since their systems forgot how to process B-12 from natural sources.
Jane is going a little overboard here by bringing up extremes with the blood and pig pens. Fruits and veggies have their problems too like ecol i strains, pesticides and preservatives. You can buy meat that comes from healthy animals that were raised without hormones and cramped conditions and get it without all the nitrates and preservatives. Sometimes you pay a little more but the demand is growing and bringing prices down. You don't have to quit eating meat altogether but fruits and veggies are typically more healthy.
It's been said that the human digestive system with all it's curves and angles was meant for vegetarian diet when compared to that of a dog or big cats that have more or less a straight digestive tract. It's also been said that some blood types are meant for a more carnivorous diet. If eating meat was so unnatural there wouldn't be so many carnivore animals. The best thing to do would be to grow your own fruits n veggies and raise or hunt your own animals. Since not everyone can do that, the next best thing is to look for organic or minimally processed foods and lean toward eating minimal amounts of meat. How can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat?
For all of you who are so worried about the environment that you are willing to sacrifice my quality of life for your cause. i would like to point out that the greenest thing you can do for the environment is to kill yourself. Please feel free to take this all important step for the environment. Just think of all the trees you'll save in toilet paper alone by ending your miserable lives. Not to mention the all the methane that won't get in atmosphere from all the crap that falls out of your mouths.
People actually feel guilty about eating animals? Only when you overcook it, in my experience.
As usual, vegetarians can't make their case without it being an emotional, ethical one, because there is nothing unnatural about eating meat for a human being. It's a part of almost every culture's diet on the face of the earth. Our social skills and even the size of our brain developed the way they did because of hunting and eating meat. The problem is that Americans, for the most part, simply eat too much of it.
There's nothing wrong with being a vegetarian, and it can be a very healthy lifestyle. But there is nothing wrong or unnatural about eating animals. This is why vegetarians need to stick to the health benefits of moderation in their arguments.
how did this get onto CNN? LOL
GARBAGE Your d*mn right my plate is swimming in blood. People kill people. People kill animals. At least people eat the animals. Maybe you should focus more on people killing people, instead of your self righteous same the animal crap!
I think going vegan is a good idea. Plus I work at the grocery store which sells tofu turkey and it is a really seller, plus my mom use to make me tofu sandwich's for lunch. So please quit complaining and just enjoy life. I have defended National Parks, animals and I just saw five eagle rays while on vacation 2 weeks ago . So if they could talk they would smack those hunters and claw them, so that way the hunter suffers. So Vegan is a great idea. Thanks.
I love animals.
They are absolutely DELICIOUS!
Omnivore for life!!
I can certainly understand the protest against factory farms, however, not everyone obtains their meat from these sort of operations. I also hope, lest she be hypocritical (which most people are, regardless of what they eat) that she buys her veggies only from small, family farms or grows them herself, factory farms also produce vegetables, and are notorious for hiring illegal's and then treat them horribly, and yes, even illegal immigrants have more rights as humans than cows or pigs do (which I doubt a lot of vegans would agree with). Lastly, I'm sure this woman is a city girl, never actually been to a small family farm, they treat their animals w/ respect, after all they are their livelihood .
I never watched her show, but she makes a lot of excellent counterpoints here. I thought the meat-lover was just making a classic case of rationalization for something that he doesn't in his soul believe is right.
Guilt trips don't work on me. Sorry, I will be grilling a steak this weekend and eating it with delight.
" How can you talk about peace if your plate is swimming in blood?"
How can you eat tofu when it's smothered in sanctimony?
Let's get smart about how we raise and slaughter food animals. End the inhumane treatment and pay a little more at the grocery store–who am I fooling, it's all about money whether it's animal or plants.
To all who want a laugh on this topic please watch The Food Chain http://cinemasaville.com/videos/food-chain
Enjoy!
Reason #6 – You taste better than meat eaters.
I urge all vegans/veggies to read "The Vegetarian Myth" by Lierre Keith - a vegan.
You mean the book that's skewered here? http://skepticalvegan.wordpress.com/2010/03/19/myths-of-the-vegetarian-myth/
At the end of the day, what you eat is your choice. We are lucky to live in a society were people have the option to either eat meat or not eat meat. We have choice and no one is forcing you to choose something against your will. Enjoy your well season squash and I will enjoy my bacon cheeseburger – I'm not forcing my food culture on you, I'm just eating my choice in peace.
Not animals??? what the FFFFFFUUUU? were worst than animals more like it..."animals" should be called something more better like humans...we should be called animals
The only thing I take issue with is people claiming they are some sort of evolutionary leap ahead of meat-eaters. The author also attempts to make some point about peace and blood-soaked plates, as if the carnage of the butchery is happening right there on the table. Sorry, author, but some folks do not imagine the butcheries when consuming animal products. Also, for those who keep using the term "rotting meat" – the veggies you are eating are also in a state of decay. The argument on both sides will never be won.
God I love meat. The best thing about Jane and all her cronies is that there's more meat left for me. Ohhhh, meat. Goood!
Ok, to all the comments about the factory farming industry, and its horrible practices what about i do this. Instead of giving up meat, which i have no want to do, i make the decision to buy from a local organic ranch. They raise beef, pork, chicken, and eggs all free range, no slop feed, no weird drugs, even the beef is grass raised and finished, no annimals kept in cages. Would that be ok with you then?
My guess is no.
clearly she is a lesbian, making her a true vegetarian. i am just sick of listening to her liberal nonsense. someone needs to tell ms. mother ducking nature that there might be a few bigger issues in the world than my thanksgiving turkey not being able to vote in our upcoming elections.
Who wants a piece of this?
If God did not want us to eat meat he would not of made cows out of STEAK! The problem with vegetarians who choose to be, and want everyone else to be, for guilt reasons are claiming that humans and animals are the same, which is a moral fallacy. If someone truly believes that they are just the same as the animals, let them go live in the woods naked with absolutely nothing from the modern world.
stupid, preachy, self-righteous, c&nt...food chain!!! Deal with it you have incisors.
I suspect you have a brain as well but we aren't forcing you to use it to its full potential.
one word: incisors
Jane doesn't really count very well. She just tries to say "guilt" five different ways.
If you buy the guilt trip fine I kill vegies too.
Compromise. No need to have meat for breakfast lunch and dinner. Just have it a couple of times a week for a special treat and with all the money y